I possible have a slight different view as a user of Social Media I don't think here is any harm in this type of "Product" and aimed at the right person like Paul Allen he has already won some great clients and brought them along to our conference back in February. But, it is only valuable if you have marketing, Sales/Media experience.

I agree with Nigel Morgan that some people will not get any financial benefit from this, it's a bit like asking me to talk about Social Media, that is not my skill. And I possible would take too long to gain any financial rewards as my skills set is different. Just because I use Social Media does not make me an expert!

But I do think there is a place in the market for this "product".

I would really like to see Nigel Boterill find Social Media Business Managers that are the right fit. Then two speakers that I highly recommend could share a stage together (now that would be brilliant).

Thanks for your thoughts Debra, and you are right about Paul Allen and how he has used MySMB. I hope he will contribute here as I have so far found him to be the exception rather than the rule.

Not least because together with a wealth of sales and marketing experience, Paul also took his time to fully understand social media and took on board a much wider range of approaches before taking the step of representing clients - so different from those who were offering themselves as established Social Media Managers within hours of completing an online course.

It would be great to see some MySMB success stories on one of your stages indeed! Let's see what comes up on here?

The comment below has just been published on the original blog post on Morgan PR about MySMB and we felt it had relevance here too - not least as the questions Naomi raises reflect this blog post too.

Thanks for posting this info, I was just searching this subject as I've just received an email from one of the MYSMB consultants/experts/people - I'm not sure what to call them.

As a small business owner I've been receiving quite a few recently, which have been starting to get annoying. I couldn't work out why I was receiving them as I've not opted in. I have just unsubscribed and it has also unsubscribed me from receiving emails from thebestof, which I actually enjoyed receiving as they related to my local area. This is very irritating.

Owning a marketing and design agency I find it hard to understand how they can a) sign up so many people to run these businesses and b)actually get clients. The emails I have been receiving are not professional at all, and the tone is desperate - very much a buy now or else approach. I do believe that this will turn off a number of potential clients. The only reason I clicked through to the website was to find out who was creating such poor emails.

Thebestof busines appears to have done very well, although they can also been quite pushy. Perhaps I will approach them to see if they would like a professional email service.

I would be interested to see the type of clients who use these services.

Great article Nigel - very balanced. Having now had direct experience of MySMB, I can address your requests clearly:

* I have no evidence that it will 'work'.
* I have not seen a financial return on investment but investment in training and CPD is important for me, so it has been worth the out lay from this point of view.
* I cannot defend their claims to make thousands of £££. Although it may be true for some, I don't agree with the way it is being sold to the masses - and told one of their sales guys Stuart Bevins this!

Have a look at my blog for more on my experience so far....

p.s, how do you reduce a blog address to those tiny few letters that everyone else seems to tweet? - still learning!

Thanks for your contribution Yvonne and congratulations on your blog - if you open it up to comments I'll repay the gesture! Creating original blog content is a trick it took MySMB graduates a long time to learn, so far from being green, you are ahead of the curve!

Considering how quickly the MySMB crowd jumped on the original blog I am wondering why they are not commenting on this blog?

As for shortening URLs or web addresses, tools like Hootsuite (affiliate link) will automatically shorten addresses.

Hi Nigel,

I mainly do Online Marketing consulting such as Web Design, SEO, Social Media, Data capture integration, Blogging and Blog set up etc. I help businesses increase traffic to their websites and build their online presence.

I purchased MYSMB but not to be a manager but to get more resources for my Social Media training. I thought the product was really good and taught a lot. After learning more and more I have no issues teaching Social Media, and as such have been asked to consult at a training center in London on a regular basis. Today I was asked to consult to a large agency on behalf of them for their clients.

My website is pretty kick ass in my opinion (www.superioronlinemarketing.com), I have good SEO, and I know how to use Social Media. I blog fairly often and they are good action packed posts where I give information away for free.

I didn't go to uni to get a degree in 'Social Marketing' or any other form, and I believe you can train yourself up in a relatively short period of time to provide a good service in an industry you are passionate about. I have only been doing Internet Marketing for less than a year and know more than most would in the industry. Why? Because I educate the hell out of myself and surround myself with the best business owners in the country. I am 27 years old, own 5 properties, a property management company and a successful Online marketing business. I go to seminars, network religiously, and help anyone and everyone.

If you buy a course or a business and expect to make money with your eyes closed, you are really going to struggle getting ahead in all areas of your life. Build a name, a reputation, learn the skills and you will do fine.

Because I bought MYSMB, I have access to around 165 Social Media Managers who combined, know a hell of a lot of information, and that makes my job that much easier, so for that alone, MYSMB purchase was priceless. Because I don't provide Social Media management, if a client needs it, I can very confidently use members in the group to do it on my behalf and I wouldn't need to think twice.

So has MYSMB helped me. For sure. Will it help others. Definitely. But be realistic and work hard for the goals you want to achieve.

My two cents.

Aaron

p.s Got to go now as I need to send an email off now for a whole heap of LinkedIn training I have been asked to do.

Thanks for your two cents Aaron!

Clearly you already understood social media and used MySMB to enhance your knowledge and offering your training.

Ideally we want to hear from the people who didn't know anything about social media and then used MySMB to become a My Social Media Business Manager and has become as successful as the claims suggest, evidenced with ROI - or even better clients of MySMBers who can talk about their business and ROI.

But thanks for commenting!

Hi Nigel,

Nope - didn't use Social Media before hand. Hence my explanation of how MYSMB has helped.

You will find my Twitter creation date fits in quite nicely with that.

Cheers Aaron

Sorry Aaron!

I misread 'I purchased MYSMB but not to be a manager but to get more resources for my Social Media training.' to mean it was bought to help with training you were delivering. It must be a good resource if you are able to teach others social media after simply doing the course! Although I suspect you must have at least been a competent trainer?!

Referring back to the blog, we want more than defence of the product, we want to hear about clients who have triumphed, the ROI they have experienced - something that measures up to the hype!

Hi Nigel,

I have been reading your blogs with great interest and your ever so slight obsession with what is known as MySMB.

Some of your points I have agreed with that people can't pass themselves off as experts in Social Media but couldn't you use that comment against any new people entering business?

I think its very interesting that you do offer "Social Media Packages" yourself.. Maybe this high level of negative press your putting against MySMB highlights a slight insecurity in your market position for aspects of your own business practice. At the moment to me and I'd imagine to quite a few other readers out their this is what we are starting to see...

Check this out

Nigel is running a Social Media Success story competition I believe may give you some more proof.

Thanks.

....also may I just add I really like Aarons post, keep up the good work bro :)

Thanks Ross,

I'm not sure that two blog posts amid hundreds counts as an obsession! The volume of traffic they generate would suggest I am actually striking a chord and have created content people want to read. I guess my background as a journalist helps create good copy!

I'm not sure that new business people are in the same ballpark as the potential for people passing themselves off as experts after a £500 online course having been told it is the path to riches. As an established and proven provider I think it is fair to point out the risks - or as I do in this post, invite comments that offer proof and explore ROI - not that anyone has yet!

I've no issue competing with genuine providers, but already have clients who were ripped off by so called social media providers who had actually jumped on the bandwagon without knowing truly what they were doing. Have one going to the small claims court where the world was promised and nothing delivered leaving a client out of pocket and disillusioned with social media. So I assure you, no insecurity on our part, only genuine concern, as voiced last year, that this doesn't deliver.

I've seen that competition that is being run and all it seems to offer is rather nice backslapping rather than genuine proof and also it is just a handful of the many MySMB folks out there. Check through those we've encountered and there are dormant accounts, neglected blogs, duplicate copy, stolen copy - far from best practice. It might be they are doing a superb job for clients and just neglecting their own profile, but if so that is hardly professional.

As this post invited, I want clients to come forward and attest to their ROI! Say they've spent £xxx with this MySMB and achieved what return? I've messaged some of the MySMB folks being flagged as best practice in the sales blurb.... but so far nothing from them!

If this works, if my concerns are unfounded, I will happily promote them on this blog.

Btw... I notice on your website your role at 'Social Media Manager' is coming soon - are you a MySMBer perhance?

To be fair, it could be worse... These people could be buying Ecademy Digital Coaching... #justsaying

You do have a point Nikki! Do we know anyone who has paid them £7K for social media training?!

The "Social Media Manager" coming soon part is to do with the profile and page design aspect of my design company.

Does this help you?

Cheers Ross, hope it works for you and you flourish with social media

Nigel, thanks for the kind comments on the blog, as you state I did take at least four months to absorb, digest and revisit (many times) the training provided by the scheme. In defence of the training it does provide a thorough grounding in all the key areas of Social Media and also preaches best practice in terms of implementation. With my traditional media sales & marketing experience supporting my new found knowledge, I also began to follow many other respected practitioners on the subject including yourself, Ant Hodges, Graham Jones, Lewis Howes, Mari Smith to name but a few. In addition, I continue to spend many hours glued to webinars, Slideshares, YouTube videos, FAQs, trialling new software, installing updates, making notes and watching online behaviours. Only at the point where I began to understand how all the pieces of the jigsaw fitted together, did I feel confident to talk to customers.

My first customer in January 2011 was a good friend who soon recognised the potential of Social Media for his industry and was happy to give me a chance to prove myself. We developed a strategy, set monthly goals and set to work. At that stage ROI was something we had discussed but in truth neither of us really knew what to expect. We decided to review ROI at the end of a 6 month period. Within 3 weeks of setting up the accounts we had established some key contacts through Twitter in particular and 3 months later this has now led to tangible cash in the bank which has covered his initial outlay. This success was a surprise to both of us; however we are now incentivised to redouble our efforts and move forward. To that end we are now finding that YouTube is proving to be a very powerful sales tool.

The same structure has been put in place with all of my customers, but at the time of writing they are still very much in the set up phase and therefore ROI is not something that we are expecting at the time of writing, but given the example above, who knows?! Nonetheless, ROI has been discussed and suitable, measurable objectives have been set which all agree would provide the best possible opportunity to see a return on investment.

Nigel, given the history between MySMB and yourself it is hardly surprising that people have been reluctant to come forward and what you are asking them to do is also perhaps a little unrealistic, after all it’s almost as “un-British” as revealing your annual income in public! Perhaps if you were to start the ball rolling and outline the details of any success stories you have achieved with your Social Media packages, then that would encourage others to share more? However, even if people did share their experiences with you, what would that achieve? Surely your real issue is that such training is being made available to anyone and everyone, who may or may not be suited to an industry which clearly requires more skills & expertise than just that provided by an online training course? Just listing examples of success will not resolve the issue!

There is also the issue of client confidentiality to consider, also why would a customer want to reveal the details of their investment in Social Media to everyone via your blog? Knowing your integrity and expertise in this field, I am also a little surprised that you seem so keen to focus on ROI in monetary terms. For many people I speak to, they look at the ROI from Social Media in many different ways. Some see Social Media as a cost effective investment in brand awareness, some see it as an investment in new platforms , new technology (no doubt with experiences of the dot com boom still in the back of their mind). Many people have begun to see Social Media as an opportunity to take cold calling out of the business preferring instead to use LinkedIn and Twitter in particular to create new relationships which in turn develops warm leads. One business person said to me recently “What is the ROI for an iPhone? Answer: I don’t know, but I’m sure I wouldn’t be without mine!”
What I have found particularly interesting this year is the evolution of Social Media practice in the UK, something I suspect Graham Jones would be far better placed to provide data on. By this I mean how business people are using the key Social Media platforms to interact with each other.

Many still struggle with the merging of their personal and professional persona through for example Facebook and Twitter, business women in particular still seem very keen to keep their “two lives” apart. In my experience the big challenge for Social Media Managers is to get business people to properly engage with each other. Much of the business activity I see on Twitter is people selling and broadcasting, very few are engaging. Most business people seem to be on transmit and not on receive!

Convincing business people to blog for example is particularly challenging. They still need to be convinced that it would lead to ROI; they are concerned that no one would be interested in what they have to say and they believe that would not have the time available to invest in it. This, despite our best efforts to explain that it should be at the heart of all of our activity! Hand on heart, I think we can all empathise with that sentiment, in truth we all struggle to find the time because we always put out customers interests before ourselves. None of us are perfect and I see myself and indeed many of my customers and contacts readdressing their time management to find that extra hour in the day to market their businesses through this new media. If we are to believe Michael Gerber, then if we do nothing else for the client than persuade them to spend an hour a day working on their business rather than in it, then that in itself will ultimately lead to a return on investment!

When having the fascinating strategy discussions with potential new clients (mostly SMEs), the conversation inevitably widens into a complete review of all marketing activity to both potential and existing customers. Many (most!) look to Social Media to drive traffic to an unloved website which often needs to be completely rebuilt, most see the benefit of building their company/personal profile within their local area or region. Many view Social Media as a unique opportunity to network without having to leave the office. They all admit they would love to have the time to get out and meet more business people face to face, they acknowledge that it would certainly be beneficial for the business, but because they continue to feel the need to work in the business rather than on it, they cannot justify the time. These people see Twitter and LinkedIn in particular, as a more cost effective means of networking.

In my own experience, if you take the time to engage with followers and provide them with what you hope is relevant and interesting information then they will take notice. They will engage with you and I can point to a number of examples where totally unexpected introductions to businesses and potential clients have come about through postings on Twitter & LinkedIn particular. I show these interactions to potential customers as real evidence of Social Media in action and ask them if they think similar experiences could be achieved for their businesses.

Currently I see UK business people mainly using Social Media as a giant online sales & networking event which given our commercial evolution is to be expected. I detect people are becoming more happy (particularly via twitter) to connect with strangers who perhaps have complimentary interests. This initial interaction often seems to progress to email and telephone conversations and ultimately a face to face meeting where business is often transacted. It may only be scratching the surface of what Social Media can achieve, but given the fact that for many it is still a very new phenomenon in the UK (and it is challenging the very fabric of our behaviour); I don’t think that’s a bad start!

Wow! Thanks for such a heavyweight reply Paul! Almost warrants a blog in itself!

As discussed earlier in the comments, you distinguished yourself by not leaping online and promising the world the second you had signed up to MySMB. Your blog posts are original and of course you were building on a formidable marketing career. You should be heralded as a good example of how to use this training.

There are myriad ways to explore ROI without revealing precise figures - perhaps that is something I should have clarified! For example in our case study on how we used PR and social media for the independent health food shop, Natures Corner, they talked about the percentage increase in footfall that the campaign achieved - a powerful metric that does not reveal what each of those customers is actually worth each time they visit.

Have I scared off MySMBers? Considering they are still wading in on the original blog 'Why MYSMB could leave your social media caught short' rather than here I doubt it! Those who contact me privately and say they've achieved nothing like the headline figures and ask if we can help provides anecdotal evidence too. It has also been suggested to me that some of those being flagged up are actually earning internally from working with MySMB - if this were true it should be declared under new Advertising Standards Authority rules which require interests to be declared.

My concern has always been that people are told that signing up with MySMB could earn them thousands of pounds when it is questionable how many are actually achieving that as social media managers. Absolutely those who saw it as a way to promote an existing business are thriving and a credit to MySMB, but does it deliver the experience and strategic understanding that is required to help businesses triumph on social media? It also beggars belief that in all of the promotions and examples of success, testimonials and such like, you cannot click through to examine the individuals and companies mentioned? At best that is missing an SEO trick that would have helped those hard working social media mangers! At worst it frustrates attempts to easily verify - good practice is always to make those giving testimonials contactable.

Thanks again for contributing Paul and happy to present you as a good example of how to leverage MySMB and clearly you got a return on your investment and I've no doubt your clients will too.

I think Paul Allen is precisely the right kind of person that would truly benefit from such training. Already having a good background in traditional media marketing he obviously has the nous and experience to see the whole picture and be able to advise when and HOW social media marketing should come into the equation and also point out the pre-cursors to implementing such a strategy. The skill that only experience can teach is analysing a businesses target market and developing a tailored marketing strategy, not just a paint by numbers one size fits all method.

This is exactly the problem with training someone regardless of their previous experience. Social media presence is nine times out of ten not the first rung on the ladder for any businesses marketing endeavours. A good social media manager will be aware of this and would insist on the foundations being in place before launching their client on the social media bandwagon. To be able to plan a marketing strategy from anyone from a back street hairdresser to a multi-national manufacturing company takes many years of experience and a great deal of trial and error and in some cases some very inventive thinking.

There are a huge number of people offering courses to enable 'anyone' to earn 'x' many of thousands a week offering social media management to small businesses, I guess mySMB is focused on here because it is probably the only UK based one, unless of course you include Ecademy's offering at £6K a time! I'm sure it has it's merits and am positive that it is not by any means the worst product available.

I wrote a blog about the whole 'Social Media Manager' training methods here, would love to hear your comments if you have time.

Many thanks Paul and you get it!

It seems many MySMB Social Media Managers think I hate them! So not true, but to recap I, like you Paul, question the validity of offering training that claims to be able to turn you into an instant expert. Such claims cannot be justified and are often told in clever sales language - and that is why I've blogged!

Michelle Holmes, one of the poster girls for MySMB 2011 has refused to contribute to this blog, as she is perfectly entitled, and says she does not want to ask her clients to contribute either, again she is entitled. Shame though as surely they would have gone to bat for her?

What she has done and should be applauded for is record a video this afternoon that believe it or not makes the very same point I have in both blog posts about MySMB (there are only two amid hundreds!). She uses a book on parenting as a metaphor for MySMB and says the book doesn't qualify her to be a parent, anymore than doing the MySMB training makes you a social media expert, instead it is what you do with the learning that makes the difference.

To quote her:

"Let me tell you something, do not buy MySMB if you just want to become an overnight social media expert, 'cause it is not going to do that for you. Just like reading a parenting book is not going to make you an overnight success as a Mum, it just doesn't happen! I really wish it did, but you have to work at this stuff."

Amen to that! You can watch Michelle's video 'Is MySMB a con from someone who actually bought it' and follow Michelle on Twitter @_ElleHolmes

Will take a look at your blog now Paul and no doubt comment - after all commenting on blogs, whether you agree or disagree is what makes the social media world go around and is great SEO.

Nigel, thanks for the kind comments on what I now realise was quite a long blog, but sometimes you start writing and it just flows and before you know it, you've 3 pages of content! In my experience thats usually down to the subject matter, so well done on creating what has turned into an interesting debate. Also, thanks for the reciprocal comments on my Social Media 80's clubbing blog. When I see you on June 17th, for the Social Media Conference in Bracknell, we must compare notes on which clubs, could it be we were once roaming the SAME streets and dancefloors!!

Also, thanks for your kind words Paul - will have to check out your blog!

Oooooh a post on Social Media ROI, a topic close to my heart! I've just blogged on this very subject.

I am an 'original' (October 2010) MySMBer. I am making four figures monthly from my social media activity. I'm not sharing my client list with you, nor of course their confidential sales and marketing data;-).

But this 'ROI' of which you speak? Yep, I know about it too...

Check out my latest blog post on this very topic. I'm always keen to explore ROI metrics with other knowledgeable social media folks. Comments on my blog post would be most welcome.

http://www.vikgillsocialmedia.co.uk/2011/04/measuring_roi_1/

As an aside, Nigel, do you think that some (many?) MySMBers might be put off from engaging with you seriously because they are scared you are going to name and shame them, as you have re some MySMB sites? That doesn't seem like a winning 'engagement' strategy to me. If you're good at what you do, it doesn't really make sense to obsess about the competition, right?

I find that collaboration with other social media folks pays dividends, it really does. We all have our niche area of expertise and I neither mind learning from people who know things I don't; nor teaching newbies things I know that they don't.

There's still plenty of room at the inn;-)

I hope we'll cross paths sometime. I welcome that.

Vik

Hi All,

Fairly old post but a relevant comment.

I came across this site after watching the new SMB blueprint relaunch which was sent to me via some optin through the best of abingdon. I wanted to briefly mention how funny it was to search for "Mysmb" and find not the branded website but a blog optimised properly for the keyword mysmb that asks the question is it really worth it? LOL, Great job! :)

I am in the process of developing an Online Social Media Training business and have spent a long time doing so. However, I see Social Media as an integral part of SEO and Internet Marketing Combined not just as an engagement platform.

Kindest Regards, Andy