Hi Nigel,

Great post, thanks very much for quoting my recent article and also big thanks for delving deeper in to the working process of MYSMB. Everything you have uncovered only makes me madder! It truly is a pain in the side of all the hard working social media people out there.

Thanks again!

Mike

Thanks Mike!

I was thrilled that Lesley-Anne Hornbogen, who actually felt she got something from MYSMB told me about your blog!

Interesting that only supporters of our views are surfacing, no-one to defend this daft position!

Nigel

I love what you guys do in the social media arena I truly do, but I think you doth protest too much....All that really needs to be said here is - good in gets good out - You are socmedguys - not socmedpolice - if people are dumb enough to fall for this sort of thing - do you really want to deal with them?????

Thanks Nigel for the links to my material and good to see another angle on this.

Great to see the consecutive screen images and being able to play "spot the difference".

One of the biggest problems that the online world has created is also one of the most significant benefits - authenticity. We like authentic people, we only want to connect with authentic companies and we value authenticity highly.

When you are authentic online, you do well. Luckily, the online world also allows to quickly and easily spot lack of authenticity and your game of "spot the difference" does just that.

It was good to chat to you this morning – I didn’t realise I was going to be featured in your blog! MYSMB appears to have got a few people in a spin judging by the various comments on blogs and social networks.

I will reiterate. Although I have been involved in social media for over two years now (thank you for the compliment - I think she was proficient in the first place!) as with anything to do with technology changes happen at an alarming rate. We are learning all the time, different ways to enhance what we already know, the changes we need to make, what we adapt and what we drop. The training modules within MYSMB are excellent and I have gleaned information that may well be out there for free as Mike McGrail clearly states, I just hadn’t found it.

I believe this needs to be put in perspective. MYSMB is a job opportunity that will provide an income for those keen to learn, for others it will enhance a service they already provide (as in my case) and unfortunately for the remainder who don’t realise they have actually got to work at it the opportunity will pass they by.

I don’t believe there are any experts in Social Media, there are people who have become involved originally through fascination, possibly intrigue as to how global it is, realise they have a talent for it and eventually make it part of their business. Some people are better at it than others but that doesn’t make them an expert. Society will decide for themselves who they want to work with and who they want to represent them. Where Social Media representatives, for another word, will come to the fore is how they produce the ever evasive ROI for their client. We are a nation clamouring statistics. Anyhow that is another comment for another blog no doubt.

Just to confirm I did pay for the branding package which will be integrated with my existing site, under development as I type my response. Each person will choose how they want their site to look and no doubt will update it frequently as we do with our own sites so the few you have earmarked in your blog may well be working on them now.

MYSMB has provided me with the relevant information and support I expected it to. It will give other people the opportunity to run their own business however large or small they want it to be and who are we to deny anyone that. Should existing Social Media experts be concerned, well that will depend on how confident they are themselves on the packages and services they provide now. As someone who provides this service already I wish every new MYSMB person lots of luck with their new venture. I will be looking to see how they are marketing their business, just as I do with Virtual Assistants, competition is healthy. Do I feel threatened, no. It’s a very large world out there and I firmly believe there is room for everyone. MYSMB is no different to any other business; it provides a profession and a service to the business community and each and every one of us has the right to choose which provider we use to fulfil that service.

As you rightly point out I am a member of Nigel Botterill’s Entrepreneur Circle and I happen to appreciate his leadership. As we discussed on the phone we all find someone we “follow”, “admire” and listen to – Nigel happens to be one along with quite a few others whose knowledge in their individual fields I respect highly.

Hi Nigel,

Some very interesting points here. I also viewed MYSMB with some scepticism. Learning how to use some of these social media tools is not the most complicated element of running a social media campaign. The tricky part is understanding about communications, messages and how to engage with communities, a different skill set and not one easily taught overnight.

Businesses need to understand the difference between a skilled practitioner and someone with a knowledge of the 'mechanics' - knowing how to tweet, for example, is a very different thing from knowing what to say. There are some clues they can look out for - maybe a subject for your next blog post?

All the best

Kursha

Andrew - love you saying we're the Social Media Guys not the Social Media Police! I know what you mean, however what you find with people like us, we are abundant with a healthy dose of altruism. So when we see (and clearly we're not alone)dodgy dealings we feel the need to speak out. Not least as we have first hand experience of people who have been had over by so called experts who think using social media qualifies them to charge for advice!

Great word Graham - Authenticity. That is what all this comes down to, being authentic and as it stands it does not look like those sites understand the meaning of the word!

Epic post Lesley-Anne, practically a blog in its own right! I was tempted to use it as so! Thanks again for commenting.

Wise words Kursha and succinctly you identify one of the main downfalls of MYSMB and other such services. As you say, there is a big difference between understanding the mechanics and knowing what to say to effectively promote a business.

Let's hope the prospective clients of My Social Media Business know what they want to say eh?

Sorry, just Laughed out loud - I visited the MYSMB website just now - as I did not originally - does anyone else feel like laughing when they see the message - "Sold Out"! - or is it just me...(perhaps just a wry smile then?)

I know what you mean Andrew - it made my smile, but figured there was plenty enough else to write about!

As a current student (not yet a graduate ) of Nigel Botterill’s MYSMB I have been persuaded by your blog and follow up comments to try to explain why I think I have made a sound investment rather than am “daft enough to pay”. And to support @LAHornbogen.

I am not a stay-at-home mum, and even if I was, I had a life and a career before I became a mum and therefore a brain that enjoys being stimulated, and aims and ambitions just like those who make the choice to work full time.

I have been self-employed for almost eight years as a freelance PR consultant, working with a wide range of companies and organisations both directly and on behalf of other marketing/PR agencies who need either a bit of extra help or my particular expertise on an important account. I am therefore pretty good at identifying “content” that companies can communicate to raise their profile and attract more customers.

What I am not brilliant at – yet – is utilising social media platforms to communicate. However, I recognise this gap in my skills and am enthusiastic to add this service to my offering. I believe MYSMB can help me get to where I want to go quickly – and accept that comes with a price. I could probably teach myself given enough time – which as a self-employed PR consultant with two young children, a husband, a home and existing clients (oh, and a social life)… you get the picture!

I think the training (which I haven’t finished yet) and the support Nigel offers is great. I am not rushing to sell myself as a social media manager just yet though, so it’s interesting to see what others have to say about the websites, blogging etc my fellow students/graduates are launching.

What makes me sad, is the assumption that women who choose to stay at home to bring up their kids are incapable of contributing to the business world. It is a constant frustration to me that I have so much to offer in terms of PR – but that generally, unless you can commit to 40 hours a week many companies don’t have a vacancy.

I have never been very good at self-promotion and new business development has never been a priority (fortunately for me, the work keeps coming). However, MYSMB has already taught me that I can’t afford to keep quiet about my skills and talents if I want to succeed at a job I love. It’s a small price to pay. But there are some in the marketing community who make it harder than it should be.

I am planning to network within Yorkshire’s social media marketing community to find out what is happening in my area and whether there are people I can learn from, and companies I can support.

I hope they are a little less hostile than Berkshire’s inhabitants.

Thank you for your comprehensive response Helen and kudos at surviving as a self-employed PR for the past eight years - you'll no doubt be better equipped than many to use social media! And contrary to your comments, I suspect you are gifted at self promotion. Commenting here for example will earn your Twitter feed @HelenKitchen_PR many views! (presumably your branding is going to be 'Hels Kitchen' ? ;o)

Perhaps what is not clear from your comment is whether you took the MYSMB course to help your own PR business or whether you plan to be a 'social media manager' There seems to be a pattern emerging where those intending to use it to help their existing business differ from those who think that after learning how to use social media that they suddenly can start 'earning thousands of pounds a month' managing other's social media. The former has an authenticity to try and improve, while the later seems less than congruent with our own belief that you need to be living the dream before you can help others with their own social media goals.

Today, from someone following a link to this blog via LinkedIn, I've received an enquiry from someone quoted £2,000 per month by a 'social media manager', not apparently via MYSMB, who has no blog, no profile on LinkedIn, a pitful presence on Facebook and 42 followers on a Twitter account that is a four weeks old. It is those kind of charlatans that I will also rail against lest good honest business professionals are fleeced by individuals looking to my a fast buck.

I am genuinely sorry if you feel we are 'hostile' and my own success and supportive following I've enjoyed in social media since its infancy would suggest you are in the minority. I would stress that the section you take most issue with is an excerpt from a plain speaking blogger based a long way from Berkshire; actually in Edinburgh to be precise!

The great thing about social media is that while much of it is geographically based and can be leveraged as such, I have contacts all over and can assure you that those from Yorkshire are even more plain speaking in my experience!

You might want to take a look at another MYSMB blog from @socialmedialuke he takes the view that this post was the fairest of the flurry that the service has provoked.

I am very pleased to read both Lesley-Anne Hornbogen and Helen Kitchen comments... I couldn't agree more with them... I wonder why there seems to be so much sour grapes?? or is it just total fear...lol...lol...

As Helen Kitchen says " What I am not brilliant at – yet – is utilising social media platforms to communicate. However, I recognise this gap in my skills and am enthusiastic to add this service to my offering. I believe MYSMB can help me get to where I want to go quickly – and accept that comes with a price. I could probably teach myself given enough time – which as a self-employed PR consultant with two young children, a husband, a home and existing clients (oh, and a social life)… you get the picture!"

That goes for a number of us... Well mine is Sales and Marketing and six grown up kids and the grandchildren... so maybe instead of a small group of you... you know who you are...trying to pull MYSMB to pieces you should spend your time brushing up on writing about something useful on your sites ( you might like to take a leaf out of Nigel Botterills book) and consider how bad all this nonsense about MYSMB looks for you all... sour grapes never did taste very good...

Thank you for your comment Christine and I'm glad you felt Helen said it so well - attributing material to the original author was a point I made in the original post!

I'm not entirely certain why you seem to think this is sour grapes? I believe the entymology of the phrase comes from Aesop's Fables and the story of the Fox and the Grapes. The Fox is envious of the grapes he cannot reach and dismisses them as sour. Clearly none of the established social media practitioners who are involved in this debate are envious of the latest crop of MYSMB 'social media managers' as all have reached a higher level of experience and exposure than any MYSMB. The fabled fox did not dismiss the grapes he could reach and had already turned into profitable wine!

It might those who published ill-finished websites with duplicate material had taken a leaf out of your book and waited (I look forward to tweets from @stophere4 and discovering more about what you have to say on 'The Magic of Social Media Management when www.stophere4.co.uk is published.

There are good MYSMB websites emerging and I have given credit to those who show good social media practice. I have already mentioned @socialmedialuke 's blogpost at www.socialmedialuke.co.uk and this morning have seen @_ElleHolmes website at Happy Talk Social Media.

Also Christine, did you bother to read any of the hundreds of articles written to help people with social media on this site or any of the others who have commented on MYSMB? Might be an idea before you suggest: 'you should spend your time brushing up on writing about something useful on your sites'.

And again with the sour grapes! I will agree Christine that those who are bitter and envious of other's success are not attractive.

In support of Lesley-Ann, Helen and Christine who (like me) were 'daft enough' to purchase MySMB, I have to say that I too am more than happy with the product. It delivers exactly what it says it will - have you actually seen what you get?? It is not presented as a 'get rich quick' scheme and I am well aware that a lot of hard work will be required to realise any success. I have been gainfully self-employed since I left school and have been very active on social media on behalf of my clients for several years. My personal presence may not adequately reflect my experience ('the cobbler’s kids are poorly shod') but I will be changing that, thanks to my new found knowledge.

I do not profess to 'know it all' when it comes to social media, but then who does? One thing I do know is that if I don't know about something I certainly know how to find out about it.

By the way - I don't watch Jeremy Kyle and haven't changed a nappy for many, many years but I definitely could have done all that efficiently whilst cooking the dinner, Tweeting, updating my Facebook Status and completing a VAT return!!

Thanks Sara - the more the merrier I say!

The 'daft enough to pay' applies to a multitude of schemes out there looking to help wannabe 'social media managers' clamber aboard the bandwagon of which MYSMB is just one and the marketing video clearly pitched it as such - I too received the emails (which shows how poorly they were targeted!) which talked about a gap in the market and how you can manage other businesses' social media after investing in the modules. As has been articulated on various blogs, comments and by your own admission, there is a lot more hard work to be done. Compared with the websites that appeared you are different!

Clearly if you were already using social media for clients for several years I do wonder how well you did that if you have new found knowledge from MYSMB? I don't mean to be rude, but if you were already selling yourself as a social media practitioner, where was your own blog, your own twitter feed? Or at least a strong presence on LinkedIn with plenty of recommendations (btw you have given me your personalised URL for LinkedIn which does not seem to work so do check it (this is you on LinkedIn though).

Kudos for your 'cobbler's kids are poorly shod' quip and clearly you dounderstand that this is something that needs to be remedied if you plan to be a 'social media manager' for anyone other than yourself.

Also, you did not add your website when you commented. A shame because www.saragoneos.com is more original in appearance than other sites MYSMB spawned and on your first proper blog post from yesterday you credit the author. Again something others were not doing. A quick tip in case SEO wasn't included in MYSMB, if you name your pages they will be more easily found on Google, rather than letting Wordpress allocated ID numbers. A good grasp of SEO is essential for social media management.

Please do understand we applaud those who learn to improve their own performance in social media, and only question those marketing themselves as experts after brief training. None of us claim to be experts and we've been involved in learning and sharing our knowledge for many years, since social media's infancy.

This is an interesting discussion.

Just to throw something else into the mix, Concise Training is working with City & Guilds to create a qualification for Social Media.

The qualification will be achieved through assessment of practical 'how to' use the social media sites and associated applications as well as evidence that the candidate has a good understanding of best practice of social media and future developments. The qualification will be more than just a piece of paper.

The qualification will be available at level 2 (GCSE equivalent) and level 3 ('A' level equivalent). At level 3, we will also require candidates to have a good understanding of Search Engine Optimisation and open source website software.

I would be interested to hear what people think of this - both from a business and individual prospective.

If you've been driving for 3 years, you can pay £500 and become a driving instructor. Then you can teach people to do the single most dangerous thing they are likely to do (drive). No-one argues with this and states you are not competent due to the time and proven history of driving.

A training course teaches you what you need to do. Why would this suggest any kind of con? What would satisfy you self-righteous 'experts' that a MySMB graduate is competent?

What if it were a £5000 pound course over 2 years? Is that ok with you?

MySMB will teach a reasonably competent person HOW to use social media effectively to promote a business. This is something they will get value from and either don't have the time or ability to do themselves.

Any problems with that? What part of that requires having a track record of 4 years using twitter or several thousand followers? The important thing is the ability to deliver to the client.

Nigel Botterill has a proven track record of top social media skills and also in delivering training packages to franchisees to allow them to do the same.

It is really easy to criticise and to do so from ignorance demonstrates a real lack of character. Feedback on these blogs would be far more interesting from people who have done the MySMB and can comment on what it actually is as opposed to some knee-jerk slagging off by the ignorant.

200 MySMB packages have been sold (one to me, in case you hadn't guessed).

As there was no interview for the purchase, there will no doubt be some idiots out there who have bought some. They may well use the branding pack and set themselves up as established 'experts' and mislead people.

Idiots unfortunately permeate every sector. They do not reflect the quality of the training or what the majority of MySMB managers will offer.

Thanks for your comment Morgan and welcome to a debate that has been going on for a month and shows no sign of abating!

Your driving instructor metaphor is an interesting one. You are right that someone with relatively little experience can suddenly be teaching others to drive and you say no-one complains. You might be right, however running a successful PR business I have worked with several driving instructors and guess what - the most successful instructors are those who have been teaching for many years who can prove how good they are by showing how many learner drivers have passed their driving test thanks to them. Newly qualified instructors can find the marketplace challenging as people prefer experience for good reason.

That was the point I make about experience in social media. Much like driving, the day you pass you can just about take responsibility for yourself, much less so others. As with social media, just because you have taken an course does not qualify you to provide the service for others. Experience and a proven track record does that!

Let me clear, I applaud anyone learning to use social media better for their own business. However that does not mean they understand how best to use it for another business? Where are their case studies? What ROI have they proven can be achieved? MYSMB presented itself as training that would allow those taking it to market themselves as social media experts.

As an aside, for an accredited trainer of NLP I am surprised how personal you seem to be Morgan, personally I try to be far more abundant than that and would never accuse someone of ignorance! Perhaps why so many MYSMB graduates have engaged on here and not blogged about the controversy themselves. Everyone has contributed to the footprint of this blog and others that criticise MYSMB at the expense of their own. Was there a crisis management section on MYSMB because all those who comment rather than blog are behaving like users rather than experts? Also, it took some people we mentioned several days to engage so presumably they had not used Google Alerts to monitor their own reputation (which we know was featured on MYSMB!). Hopefully they are more attentive to their clients' online reputation.

Morgan, you say that with no qualifying procedure for those wanting to pay to use MYSMB there are bound to be 'some idiots'. That's a bit harsh, let's assume for a moment they are acting with the best of intentions - a quick check of the MYSMB graduates I am aware of find 19 that are apparently dormant websites still passing off syndicated copy as their own, largely associated with neglected twitter feeds. So that's almost 10% of the total who took the course are apparently not using it for themselves. Presumably they are too busy delivering for clients to walk the talk? Shame, because a successful e-footprint for your own business is great to turbo charge your clients!

It is interesting that as a graduate yourself and presumably you are in contact with many others who took MYSMB, that on your own blog you use an article that links to a provider in America. Was there no-one local able to provide the content? I'm all for the global market... but seems unnecessary when you could either produce the content yourself or ask a fellow MYSMB.

Incidentally Nigel Botterill and myself are both speakers at Keeping Business Local in Oxford on November 18th. He will be delivering his 'The 18 Secrets that Super Successful Business Owners Know - and Do… (that most business owners don’t know and don’t do!)' talk while I will be delivering a social media workshop.

The discussion goes on and on...! But Morgan's analogy with driving instructors has made me realise where this concept has all gone wrong.

His analogy completely fails. Here's why.

When you go for a driving instructor's training course you do have to pass a selection test. You are required to have a clean licence, to have a vision test and to prove you are (in the eyes of the law) "a fit and proper person". So, there's one difference - you don't just pay your money and take the course.

Secondly, when you become a driving instructor you don't just take the material provided by the course you receive and pass it on unedited to your trainees. Otherwise you would be saying "turn left" when there is no left turning...!

Even "idiots" who, according to Morgan, could buy a driving instructor's course, would know that they had to personalise their own training, otherwise it would be completely useless.

Here's where the analogy falls down. When you become a driving instructor much of what you learn is about running your own business - or capitalising on the franchise, as in the case of schools like BSM. There is plenty of help available for driving instructors on business development.

It may well be that MySMB is going to provide business development, that the franchise is not being sold rather like a get rich quick scheme.

The problem is, the only available evidence is that of the get rich quick variety - a stream of copy-cat sites and a sales page from MySMB itself which promises to "make thousands of pounds a month" "part time". It is designed, perhaps, to appeal to those "idiots" who believe that you can make easy money without much work.

So, here's a challenge. Please can any MySMB members who are making thousands of pounds a month, part time, solely from MySMB say so here on this blog - and provide the evidence.

Rather like the high-income driving instructors, the only ones who will be able to do that will be the ones who have put in hard work, who have experience and who treated the training course as merely the first step in a long career.

Thank you Nigel & Graham for your replies, you both have some interesting points. You are right to criticise those sites that are offering services and even claiming to be experts when they have not even bothered to present individual content or any kind of eveidence of competence.

Nigel, to respond to a couple of your comments, I am not yet a 'graduate' in my view of myself and have not started to offer my services for payment. This is due to me wishing to gain some experience using these newly aquired skills and to build up a portfolio of work.

I found an interesting article on an american website and shared it on my personal blog. I can't really see what is 'unnecessary' about that. I would consider it unnecessary to rewrite it in my own words or find a similar one from someone in the UK for the sake of it. Are you merely trying to find criticisms to make in an effort to muddy the validaty of my opinion?

I have yet to read any critical blog posts from someone who has completed the training package. Therefore the criticism come from those who are ignorant of the content. It is not a personal accusation but a description.

Would you write respect a film review based from someone who had only read the description on the back of the box instead of watching it?

Why your reference my qualification as an NLP trainer has little relevance to your comment, it does mean I have some background and expertise the field in skills aquisition. From this I know that expertise can be modeled and replicated in a fraction of the time that it took the expert to develop those skills. Like it or not, good training shortcuts years of experience.

This means that, to paraphrase Isaac Newton, we MySMBers may well be dwarfs in the social media world, but we stand on the shoulders of giants.

Graham, you got me, my analogy is not a perfect match. I feel it demonstrated the point I was making well but as you so astutely point out, it is far from being the same thing. If Nigel had required testing of his MySMB customers before they were allowed to start trading, then most of this negative dialogue would have been avoided.

I agree 100% with you that the only ones who will make good money out of this scheme are those that put in the hard work, build experience and treat it as the first step in a career of continual development.

So does Nigel Botterill as he clearly states in the training package. Did you really think it was otherwise and a very successful entrepreneur was desperate enough for cash that he would risk his reputation with a 'get rich quick' scheme?

I'm sure that over the next 12 months Graham that you will be fully aware of those people who are making a success of this without them having to answer to you with by putting a blog entry here.

I've been following this debate for some while now, but haven't until now felt the urge to enter the lion's den or, as a football pundit talking about Manchester City on 5Live last week said in an image that I'm still struggling to get my head around, "Catapult myself into the goldfish bowl". But now I want to respond to Graham's last post on the reasons that people got into Nigel Botterill's MySMB offering.

Obviously I can only talk about myself, but I think it's a comment applicable to all the MySMB people when I say that anyone who has gone into this in the belief that it's a "Get Rich Quick" scheme is seriously deluded. Just do the maths - to get rich, you have to put in the hours and do a great job for your clients. That takes time, that most valuable of resources. Does anyone seriously think that they could charge (say) £1,000 a month to clients and only put in a few minutes a day? If they do, then they won't last more than 3 months in the Social Media Marketing space. And to be fair, Nigel Botterill himself said as much in one of the training webinars.

So why am I doing this? Firstly, I have been in marketing for nearly 25 years now and as long ago as 1995 took the CIM Marketing Diploma so I look upon Social Media as a great addition to the marketing toolkit. And by marketing, I do not mean advertising. Social Media lends itself perfectly to the definition of marketing as "Satisfying user's requirements profitably" because the interaction with customers and potential customers that is possible via media like Twitter or Facebook is the first step of finding out what those customer requirements are - it's about listening and engaging, not shouting.

Secondly, at the age of 58 I no longer want to be an employee, I want to be in control of my own destiny and running a small SMB business is an ideal way to use my marketing experience and my familiarity with IT to bring in a reasonable income while also satisfying my own customers' requirements. The added benefit of not spending all that time commuting to London on a virtually daily basis is just the icing on the cake.

My aim, far from making lots of dosh for no effort, is to help small to medium sized local businesses grow their own bottom line by enabling them to get closer to their customer base, attracting new customers and retaining a loyal customer following. Of course I want to be paid to do that because I'm not a charity, but I will only earn a reasonable income by doing a good job for clients.

What I will NOT do, on my own behalf or for clients, is just push out a blog and 10 tweets every day on "17 top SEO tips", "The 23 keywords you must include in your blog", "How Twitter can cure cancer" and so on. Quality is the keyword, not quantity.

Finally, and to link the previous 3 comments together, one of the MySMB folk runs a very successful chain of driving schools; the challenge to all readers anal enough to want to track down every single MySMB website is to identify who that is.

Thank you again Morgan,

I'm sure Graham Jones will contribute his own response and I will publish it when he does!

Kudos to you Morgan for waiting until you have experienced using social media. Similarly just last week I met someone who had taken the course who dimissed it as 'good for the basics' and said they need to learn how to us it now. Like you they are waiting - but clearly plenty of MYSMB folk are already touting themselves as experts! Hence the whole premise of this blog and others.

My reference to Neuro Linguistic Programming was merely to suggest I was surprised at your overall approach as an NLP Trainer in how you address this. I am only a practitioner but do aim to be abundant, sharing my own experience and in this case that includes raising awareness of so called social media experts ripping of businesses trying to get to grips with social media. Keep in mind the original post which tackles

Currently I have an associate who is still waiting for a MYSMB graduate (by graduate I simply mean someone who has taken the course!) to come up with the goods for a client after promising the earth. It has the potential for a great MYSMB case study as so far they have been underwhelmed!

We host many guest posts on this blog Morgan, and we always comment on who they are and why we are sharing it. We would never arbitarily post something without giving some insight into what we feel it adds. I just find it odd that you would not blog about anyone from MYSMB or the training itself but instead use a widely distributed article that links to an American provider. Are you endorsing them and familiar with their work? If so I apologise and obviously it makes sense - but do think of the value an intro would add.

If by your comment "Would you write respect a film review based from someone who had only read the description on the back of the box instead of watching it' you mean to suggest we are criticising MYSMB without experiencing it, again perhaps your analogy is flawed! I wrote this blog after watching the sales video, interviewing those who had done it and examining the initial results. I guess it would be a bit like making a decision to see a film based on the reviews of those who have seen it, which is how most people decide whether to see a movie! Do not make the assumption that anyone who has not been on this course is ignorant of what it offered. Point me to someone who is earning what it promised and delivering value for that money. I'd like to blog about that.

I think I know what you mean by paraphrasing Isaac Newton's 'shoulders of giants' quote. I believe it was Coleridge who said "The dwarf sees farther than the giant, when he has the giant's shoulder to mount on." Hopefully the approach we give on this blog gives people a leg up on to the right giants.

Do shout if you would like to reproduce any of the content on this blog as a guest post Morgan.

Thank you for your contribution Martin and as I said to Morgan, I know Graham will respond to comments about his posting.

I hope no-one was deluded into thinking MYSMB was a 'get rich quick' scheme, however I know how much the sales video hyped it as a quick and easy path to riches. That was always our big concern and nothing we have seen suggests anyone is delivering a service that warrants the return the promotion offered.

Your background in marketing makes you ideal to use social media professionally Martin and I wish you every success. I would suggest that your penultimate paragraph is right about quality, but you misunderstand the power of blogging for your client if you think daily blogs will not help them.

Finally, Google means you do no have to be anal to find stuff out - might you be suggesting someone with the initials KW?!

This is now a very long page and I've had to scroll a long way down to be able to make this comment - which means this post and the resulting comments show it is clearly a subject of much interest.

Thanks for the comments on my comments...!

Now, I won't get into the NLP debate - as an academic psychologist I can go on for hours and hours about the subject if you want...! Suffice it to say there is much rubbish written and said about NLP and there is much rubbish written and said about social media. And I grant you there is much rubbish written and said about psychology and academics, for that matter...!

My point really is that in much of life the 80-20 rule applies.

It looks like the people supporting MySMB, such as Morgan and Martyn are amongst the 20% of people who "get" the need to be individual, to master the process and to offer a unique, in-depth service based on hard work and experience. But the chances are 80% of the 200 people who have been on the MySMB training courses do not "get" that.

That means that 80% of the income for MySMB will come from people who just do the training and go no further.

It also suggests that 80% of the MySMB websites will be largely untouched by human hand - including things like "insert name here" on them.

That WILL damage the brand and all associated with it. Other template systems have suffered the same fate. Unless EVERYONE changes the templates, the brand suffers. Or, if you are like a franchise operation, such as McDonalds, then everyone MUST (by commercial contract) follow the EXACT rules. But MySMB doesn't appear to be offering that, hence the only option is EVERYONE changes the template.

If you do "get" it, then you will also "get" that a template system which does attract the "get rich quick" brigade will be damaging to the 20% of people who understand the value in being authentic.

In other words if you "get" what MySMB is offering, you also "get" that you should not need it.

And, Morgan, to tell me that the people making money from it will be "obvious" without them having to answer me is a huge admission. Either it means that MySMB is going to be so successful we will all know who is making money from it, or that the people who make money from it will let us all know they are doing so by some kind of osmosis. I doubt either of those things will happen.

So, my challenge is still there. If this is such a good scheme, give me the evidence - not opinion based on 12th Century quotes, some guesswork and some kinaesthetic feeling.

Nigel,

I think we're agreeing violently here. My comments about blogging were not meant to suggest that a daily blog is not valuable, merely to say that a blog written only for the purpose of ticking an item off a daily to-do list has no merit unless it says something useful, interesting or amusing (or maybe all three).

When I read blogs that have nothing but cut-and-paste from Mashable, I tend never to go back and look again. If someone posts an interesting blog item, chances are I'll want to revisit their site on a regular basis.

Martyn, you're right! We agree about blogging!

Hmmm, can't remember how I ended up here from this morning! Had the page open all day and only just read it.

Lesley-Ann (I follow you under another guise ;o) - not stalking, honest!) & Helen, I have seen you around. You both make fine and valid points, as does Sara.

I can't help but notice a kind of preciousness about SM that some seem to hold. The end client is surely responsible for their decision making as to who's services they use - as with anything. If the campaign isn't working, and that should become apparent quite quickly, then get another SM manager.

I think it far more outrageous how much so called SEO experts charge for their "magic" that isn't usually even something the end client can "see" - at least with SM it's very visible how certain social media activity is taking place - how many tweets/ the content/ relevancy along with facebook updates, perhaps postings in relevant forums.

None of it is rocket science, so please stop trying to make it a mystical thing that only certain people can achieve (i.e. men who don't have to be stay at homes with all that that entails - yes, I think us women have a right to not like that sentence... one little bit!!)

As for Concise Training and trying to get a C & G accreditation for Social Media... yet another qualification to be endured? Just so we have a piece of paper proving we can do what we say we can - or worse, a piece of paper for someone good at doing qualifications but not so good at putting it into practise! (I have quite a few qualifications in different subjects and I can't keep doing them! They cost money and take time and often it's training for the sake of training!) lol I could rant about this for awhile, but won't! and breathe...

Anyway, I am sure all our micro-blogging on this thread is doing Morgan PR no end of good in the rankings!

Ladies... well done, you! :o)

Thanks for your addition to the debate Rosie!

Sadly some so-called social media managers are busy ripping clients off just like some so-called SEO experts. Just because they are tweeting or updating Facebook or blogging does not mean they are doing it right or contributing to their client's business objectives.

It is almost as if we understand the power of blogging and social media! Something we freely share and are not at all precious about!

Hi - an interesting read with great points made on either side of the argument. The MYSMB approach will achieve financial success for it's founder and no doubt for some of it's followers/franchisees. And there have been, and will be, variations of this approach across every conceivable sector - certainly loans, ebay dropshipping and a few others have already been tried.

An interesting thought is that if social media is an ecosystem where we as participants and practitioners determine the environment - then the success and failure of different approaches will largely rest with us all. Therefore the longevity of this approach will be worth observing - and perhaps we may need to think in different terms for the different types of participants within the ecosystem. A somewhat Darwinian principle - but is it the survival of the fittest?

I like your idea of it being an ecology!

Of course it was Herbert Spencer who actually coined the phrase 'Survival of the fittest' after reading Darwin's 'On the Origin of the Species'. Darwin called it 'Natural Selection'

Whether 'Survival of the fittest' or 'Natural Selection' the truth is it would seem many of those MYSMB graduates have already failed to act on the training they paid for. It would seem they have already gone the way of the Dodo, or at least are an endangered species!

It's late and I may ramble... apologies...

After spending the day in London with a long term client who is now exploring the social media services that my company offers, it puzzles me to see how some of these MYSMBers can expect how people wont be able to see past the 'new' nature of their business if they leave the course and set up charging £100's if not £1000's per month. As Graham asks above... show us the evidence of working in social media for a while before charging clients.

I am not asking for evidence as a social media manager under your MYSMB guise, but before... and kindly I request you use examples that prove on more than one occasion that you have had success for either companies you have worked for or clients.

Someone putting themselves out there as an expert that cannot prove how they have done this work before is clearly doing it out of hollowness as any expert must provide huge credibility... or is this asking too much?. As a social media expert you should then realise how easy it is to uncover any false perception that you put out.

I also take umbrage with One MYSMB grad who attended a social media seminar that I ran on The Social Media Mindset has now set you a MYSMB business while also working for a PR company. As most PR companies are running social media... is this not a conflict of interest? Should the employers question the motives of this member of staff? And if they came to my event less than a year ago... does this really give them them ability to set up in business?

My other point as and SEO consultant to contradict Rosie's point above, all professional SEO people should be clear and transparent with their clients and customers about what they are doing. Time and time again I come across disgruntled business owners who have ongoing contracts with so called SEO experts and when I ask them what they are doing for the money, the same answer comes... "I don't know"

In my view, and the way we work, is that everything that we do is logged and reported back to the client, justifying our reason to invoice any work. There is no 'magic' and those that are not transparent with their clients could be using dubious or back hat techniques. Link building campaigns should be logged for every link that is built. Content optimisation should be itemised. Pay per click campaign management should be reported with KPI reports for clients... if any of your SEO people don't do this... find another that will be open, honest and transparent.

The same goes for social media. There is no 'magic' and there are no secrets. Twitter even has its own business guide.

If as a social media consultant you do not provide a clear roadmap of all your activity, what you will be doing for he client, a log of 'done' work, measurement devices and follow up for every client, they will get disillusioned by what you are delivering and will find someone that they will be able to see past the facade.

Ethical social media consultants is what the business world needs... totally transparent... providing real value... providing real evidence of a positive ROI for clients... using ethical 'social' techniques for successful social media marketing for clients.

As my blog post says (linked below) the best of the bunch will come out in the wash. Having attended pretty much what is available for $60 from Lets Get Social in the USA, I hope MYSMBers feel they have got value and really develop profitable businesses for themselves. I just hope that the few that may not deliver real value because of the lack of experience, will stop... get the experience and then jump back in.

My final point is about the hast tags #nigweb and #mysmb - take a look on twitter. It is full of fellow MYSMBers saying 'Like my Facebook page' 'I need more likes' - generating a false perception for clients. Clearly if you are in a club you will get likes... but this is part of this whole false perception being generated for clients that wont be able to tell that this is generated by other doing the course... is this an ethical tactic?

This is long enough now... I could go on... Great that this is getting more attention Nigel (Morgan)

Thanks Ant! Great and detailed comment and in no way a ramble!

I concur on much of what you said and if someone were working for Morgan PR while sneaking off and running a sideline business you have to question their loyalty and sanity, perhaps only being overwhelmed by how naive they must be.

You are right about how MYSMB people are using the #mysmb and #nigweb hashtags to cajole for 'likes' on their fledgling Facebook pages. If they were creating original content that organic fans liked and enjoyed, they would engage and comment, spreading the good word and getting them more 'likes'. That would involve understanding how social media works!

OMG! Just seen someone on those hashtags has just asked for people - anyone following them or their hashtag - to become LinkedIn with them! Did MYSMB not explain how LinkedIn should be used and they've not been warned about stranger danger on LinkedIn!

Nigel

Suggest you worry about your own business and let MYSMB people get on with theirs. There are plenty of people out there calling themseves experts (me included) and its up to the public to make their minds up who is and who isn't.

Yes, I also bought into the MYSMB deal as I wanted to add onto my present business and this was a way of doing so quickly. There is plenty of business out there for all and as in anything in life the cream will eventually float to the top. I chose not to do the branding package as I have my own branding already, but I will say the comradeship amongst MYSMB people on twitter and fb is welcoming and refreshing.

If all this annoyes you so much, easy answer is don't follow the #nigweb hashtags. Move on mate. You are so much more better than the rest of us plebs obviously so why worry? Lifes too short.

Hi Ant,

You're not really contradicting me because I agree with you that "ethical" anythings should be transparent and accountable... however, we all know that there are many, shall we say, not so ethical SEO companies out there promising all sorts, especially Google top spot - we can't all be there in our given professions! We know that, but many unsavvy punters will sign up for it.

lol - you can all "like" my page, if ya like, that is ;o)

Your concern for my welfare is touching John!

I do worry about my business. Thanks to the amateur antics of the faux social media experts more and more people are annoyed when they have been fooled by 'social media managers' who are just jumping on the bandwagon. Already I have two clients who were ripped off by people who claimed to be social media experts. Hence why I and indeed other experienced social media practitioners blogged about MYSMB when the marketing material claimed you could make thousands of pounds working part time.

Those hashtags reveal the very amateur nature of those who have trained with MYSMB, begging for 'likes' on Facebook, asking for strangers to become LinkedIn with them, dodgy Twitter practices - all with the aim of making themselves look more professional than they actually are! Cream does float to the top, but it isn't the only thing and I like to help keep the beaches clean!

As for leaving it alone... I had! This blog was published on October 13 and was busy for a few days and then life moved on. Of course Google is still sending plenty of people to this blog post and one of them commented over the weekend and the debate has been sparked off again and the footrprint of this blog just gets bigger with every comment.

Actually that is the entertaining thing! Clearly MYSMB has taught its trainees nothing about crisis management - an essential part of managing social media. If they had all those who have jumped on here to comment would have realised they are promoting this blog. Only one MYSMB person who had started blogging since training had the social media savvy to blog themselves and draw the debate to them. Consequently they appear in the search engine results as we do. Google MYSMB and second to the actual product is this blog post, attracting many visits daily, and largely thanks to the naivity of those who had paid to learn the secrets of managing social media through MYSMB!

Kudos on you though John for only having orginal material on your own blog, not the generic nonsense that so many MYSMB folk have that they are trying to pass off as their own. Clearly you already got much about promotion through social media before taking the course! Keep up the good work!

Sorry I am a bit late joining this debate.  

I thought you might like to hear from someone who bought a MySMB package and asked for a refund.

I got caught up in the hype and when an email came through with the video showing the offering and claiming that  it only takes a few minutes a day etc I started thinking perhaps I should be getting into this ? I then called the number on the video to ask a few questions.  

The first question I asked was if I purchased one of these packages how much support would I get to help me get to grips with this ? Now in hindsight I should have run a mile at this point because the response I got was not very encouraging.   The stuttering person at the other end of the phone told me something to the effect that I would be able to ask some questions for a short while after purchasing.  

I then made the fatal mistake of asking how many packages had been sold so far (this was at about mid day after the video had been released at 10am) ? I was told 49 so far (only the first 50 would get the extra day training at Solihull) ? so I jumped in with both feet.

I never felt completely comfortable with my decision but then after viewing more of the info and some of the modules I felt pretty bad.   A couple of things became clear straight away ? one that this was going to take much more time than was claimed (I don't have much time as I run another business) and that there would have to be more money spent on subscriptions to this and that to see this through. 

I fundamentally disagree with the claims that this could be managed in just a few minutes a day or that realistic monthly earnings could be up to £5,000.

When I called the company to ask for a refund I was passed to a couple of different people before being told there are no refunds!   When I asked why I was told that as soon as I had downloaded the material I had had all the value of the product!   I told him this was completely ridiculous and they would not get away with treating people in this way.   My circumstances were genuine and I had not tried to pull a fast one ? I just wanted to be treated fairly and justly.

To cut a long story short I was eventually told that there was 'good news' and that 'as a gesture of good will' they would give me my refund - but then I was told they were charging me an admin fee of £50+VAT  to cover their time spent in order to refund me!   When I was eventually contacted to get my card details for the refund I asked the lady how difficult it was to issue a refund? 'Oh it only takes a couple of minutes, it's really easy' I was told!

Finally a message to Nigel Botterill who according to his twitter profile always 'tries to do the right things in work & life': "If you wake up one day and think actually this guy has not been treated very well - then give me my £50 + (£8.75 VAT) back!!!"

Thanks for this Don,

I have to say when we kept hoping for a success story from MYSMB, a case study where they had truly helped someone through social media, we hadn't anticipated getting feedback from someone so disastified with the service. Clearly you felt you were mis-sold to and that does come back to our major concern, that the product was hyped to be something it wasn't and becoming an experienced, talented and proven practitioner of social media takes more than this course!

I hope the experience with MYSMB has not discouraged you from using social media as there is a lot to be gained from it when it is done right.

LOL! It looks like the MYSMBers have gone all Anti-Social now... check out this tweet from @AndyCockayne>

"...pls don't use #nigweb & #mysmb anymore - use the FB 'closed' groups instead..."

What is this all about? Why the secrecy? Is this not fuelling the fire?

Goodness what a 'Hornets' nest you have opened Nigel.

Ok, having read your original post and read/ scanned the many responses; I  understand your frustration at seeing, not only your specialism being tarnished (potentially) by what appears to be the misuse of the training opportunity presented to members of the business and public, but also the possibility of 'innocents' (using the term advisedly) being taken for the proverbial ride. And the blogs do seem to suggest that the system is flawed, and the resulting 'learning' is 'a bit of a rip off'.

Having said all that, your blog Nigel was 'a bit heavy', it showed your anger and frustration, where it should have shown a relatively impartial view to prevent it looking like 'sour grapes'.

To truly educate with your blog posts it is important to stop and take stock of your words before sending/ posting etc...Then go back re-read and if necessary remove emotionally charged words/ phrases/ sentences to alleviate the earlier stated 'sour grapes' or in other words to present an unbiased view/ account.

You would IMO have been better to write a critical assessment, instead of a personal attack. Sorry, but because of the way it is written does come across as a personal attack Nigel. I am neither attacking your opinion nor approving the 'training' being sold. Splinter removal service on special offer!! ;-)

Thanks for that Lynda and sorry if it reads like a personal attack! I do quote a far more aggressive attack from another blog which some have mis-read as my own words!

To clarify my concern, and one that is clearly shared and indeed illustrated by some of the responses, is this:

• MYSMB was sold as a 'get rich quick' scheme.
• We've seen precious little evidence on anyone who did the course flourishing.
• The fact that repeatedly, even though I explain it, they comment here rather than owning the debate on their own blog! This shows a clear lack of understanding of how social media works! Assuming they did not want more people to see this blog.

Perhaps significantly, this blog is the only one where Nigel Botterill did not come and fight his corner. On the myriad other critical blogs where he did the debate quickly died down. Consequently individuals have tried to argue the case with varying degrees of success.

I'm a big supporter of The Best of franchises and have dealt with many and think they are a terrific service, so have nothing against the good business models that Nigel Botterill has created. However I felt and still do feel that MYSMB risks misleading people into thinking they have someone with expertience, talent and strategic vision, when what they actually could have is someone who simply signed up to a 'get rick quick' scheme.

I would add, the private DMs and emails I've received from users who do not wish to be quoted publicly show grave concerns that also underline my own worries about this.

Thanks again Lynda!

A very interesting debate.

I notice that there are now in excess of 40 comments against this thread.

It reminds me very much of a wise old saying “You cannot buy experience”

I have been involved in software development for 16 years and of those I have spent 13 years in website design and development.

The same is true in the web development world. Another wise saying I heard from a fellow Web Development Company hits the mark, “Anyone can build a website”. The problem is, do you get a return on your investment.

The two primary reasons for having a website for your business are:-

• 1. Attracting targeted visitors
• 2. Turn those visitors into some form of contact

I have seen marketing company’s over the last 13 years fail to deliver on the web because they don’t understand Internet Marketing. Internet Marketing is different to what I all old school marketing. Read any book by Seth Godin if you want to know more. Nigel Morgan introduced me to this Web Guru a few years ago and I’m glad to say Seth concurs with the approach we have taken over the years.

Returning to Social Media; Social media is an important cog in your marketing wheel. You can only learn how effective it can be by actually “doing it” and learning what works and what doesn’t.

“You cannot buy experience”

Thanks for that comment Adrian, you identify an interesting parallel!

In the interests of transparency we should point out that your business created this fabulous website in such a way that each and everyone of these comments further stamps the Morgan PR e-footprint on to the debate via the search engines!

To conclude, if anyone wants to speak to a 'Can do and does' web guy... Speak to Adrian from Companion Computers.

Fascinating debate. And an important one...

For me, this issue boils down to two elements. As Graham mentioned, being 'authentic' is absolutely fundamental. I spend many hours toiling away to create original, genuine copy. Every word in my blog or marketing copy is written by me. It gives me credibility, and proves to the world that I can write. Moreover, that I'm professional. That matters to me, as I know I can give value to my clients.

Whether templates are given to MYSMB subscribers or not, the fact remains that if you 'pose' as admin, the reader expects a certain honesty that you have written the post yourself. To see identical blog posts is deceptive. I'd go so far as to say dishonourable... If it's just a case of populating a blog quickly, so it 'looks' as if the social media manager is experienced, that's even worse.

For those of us who have been using social media for a lot longer than 3 months (sic), this goes against everything that social media stands for.

The other factor here is 'experience.' I've been in the communication industry for 20 years, a copywriter for three and been actively using social media for almost two years now. However, I don't pitch myself as an expert and I don't know everything. That said, having left behind a successful teaching career to write for a living, I know how tough it is to make it out there. It's taken me time to hone my talents and be in the position I am today.

As Adrian said, you can't put a price on experience - built up naturally over time. I can only confidently give clients advice about how to use social media to their advantage from 'living' it...

Just in the case of 'copywriters' who gratingly agree to write a sales letter for a fiver, I do hope that this doesn't dumb down the true social media professionals out there...

Thanks Nikki,

And kudos to you for carefully reading all the comments - I guess as a great copywriter you have an eye for detail?

Yours is one of the more thoughtful and considered comments too. Coming from an experienced user of social media it is great to see you concur with our thoughts about social media and the potential that MYSMB has to deceive people into believing they have encountered a professional and experienced practitioner.

Now earlier today I met the man behind MYSMB - Nigel Botterill, who was speaking about business at Keeping Business Local in Oxford. He initially declined to give a video interview to answer questions about MYSMB, but later said he would and but for a flat battery I would have been uploading that by now as I was unable to reach Nigel before he needed to head off from a nearby hotel. We did however chat some more and I should be interviewing him next week - so watch this space.

I am closing these comments now so unless you have your own question about MYSMB you would like me to pose to its founder, please do not comment any further!

Comments are now closed on this thread.

Nigel

When you interview Mr Botterill you may wish to ask him about their refunds policy (I have a feeling I know what he will say - handled sympathetically on an individual basis) - but in reality it is:

1. Tell them bluntly there are no refunds
2. If they persist after a couple of weeks get them to email/write in to Nigel Botterill explaining circumstances/reasons
3. Keep putting them off as long as possible by saying Nigel Botterill is busy.
4. Only if it is clear they are not going to go away then give them a refund but charge them a £50 (+ VAT) fee so we are still getting something out of them!

Also it should be noted that there was no refunds policy info shown on any of the videos/emails they sent when selling this.

And don't forget to ask him for my £50 (+ VAT) back!

Hi Guys. OK, Im pleased I came accross your info highlighting the problem with the mentioned 'train as a smm' courses. Now we have identified what course people SHOULDNT do, which course SHOULD they take, why, and do they have an affiliate program?

Thank goodness I came across this post. I was about to shell out £500 + vat for the MySMB course. I thought it could complement my existing online business and after watching the 19min sales video, I must admit I was sold!

Glad I decided to do a little research and if I have learned anything from running an online business, it is that you should steer clear of any course or package that doesn't offer an iron clad risk free money back guarantee.

Thanks for your comments David and Mark!

Since the new recruitment campaign for MYSMB began hits on this blog post have gone through the roof!

Glad to see I might have saved your business soul Mark! I've just followed you on Twitter so do ask for any help you might need! Lots of free information on here too!

Can anyone put me in touch with Don Steer. I have made the mistake of buying MySMB product yesterday. I have so far been refused a refund. I wanted to talk to him about how he managed to get a refund.

Many thanks

Many thanks Julia,

I've emailed Don Steer and asked him to contact you or post on this blog again so fingers crossed.

Also, I believe you have legal redress under the Distance Selling Regulations which guarantee you a 'cooling off' period during which a refund purchase for goods or services should be made when you cancel and you do not have to give a reason.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Thanks for posting this info, I was just searching this subject as I've just received an email from one of the MYSMB consultants/experts/people - I'm not sure what to call them.

As a small business owner I've been receiving quite a few recently, which have been starting to get annoying. I couldn't work out why I was receiving them as I've not opted in. I have just unsubscribed and it has also unsubscribed me from receiving emails from thebestof, which I actually enjoyed receiving as they related to my local area. This is very irritating.

Owning a marketing and design agency I find it hard to understand how they can a) sign up so many people to run these businesses and b)actually get clients. The emails I have been receiving are not professional at all, and the tone is desperate - very much a buy now or else approach. I do believe that this will turn off a number of potential clients. The only reason I clicked through to the website was to find out who was creating such poor emails.

Thebestof busines appears to have done very well, although they can also been quite pushy. Perhaps I will approach them to see if they would like a professional email service.

I would be interested to see the type of clients who use these services.

I have mulled over whether to give the My SMB package a go. However, after reading all the comments on here I am not undecided.

With a background in news and sports journalism I have a fairly decent grasp of social networking but obviously nowhere near what is required to run them on behalf of businesses, or as a business.

So, can anyone give me a bit more clarification?

I got in touch with several MySMB graduates via Facebook and all replied positively. One said they invested around £2k while another £1,000. The training and support came in for high praise but whether these are isolated cases I do not know.

I have looked at Concise Training's packages too and that also looks good.

Help!!

Hi Tim

I have been watching this debate with interest over the few months. I have not looked at MySMB in any detail - and so can only comment on what Concise Training offers.

At the end of last year I worked with City & Guilds to develop a certification in Social Media at Level 3 (equivalent to 'A' level). The qualification is evidence based and assessed by me and then internally/ externally verified by my registered City & Guilds centre of DawsonLoane. We cover the why and how of Social Media and encourage reflection on best practice, as well as understanding 'how' to use the available Social Media tools.

We ask candidates to complete 20 tasks including
- a review of your current marketing, values, brand and audience
- your initial aims and success targets of Social Media based on your audience
- aims, why, best practice of each of Twitter, Facebook and LinkedIn
- management tools to make the process time efficient (e.g. Tweetdeck or HootSuite)
- the use of video
- search engine optimisation, WordPress and blogging
- social bookmarkin
- mobile Social Media
- during each task we ask you to input into your social media strategy going forward - our last task formalises your social media strategy for the coming year.

Throughout the tasks, we ask you to comment on how the use of the tool reflects your brand and values - what you should say and what you should not say, what guidelines / policies may be needed in a company.

We ask people to use the tools for a minimum of 16 weeks before they can achieve certification. This is so that they can provide evidence that they can use the tools for an extended time - and continue to show best practice. In practice the qualification is taking between 6 and 8 months to complete.

My company policy is not to train in what you already know. As a result, the qualification is available in two parts:-
1. Assessment, certification and support
2. Training modules as agreed after a conversation with the individual. These can be delivered online using a virtual classroom, face to face at your client site, or workshops in Faringdon, Oxfordshire.

I am perfectly aware that qualifications are not the 'be all and end all' - but they will appeal to some people. Talking to those currently undertaking the qualification, all are enjoying the time they are taking out to reflect on how they are using the tools and have been forced to question their own practice.

I am more than happy for people who do not require the qualification to attend my workshops or online training - and indeed at the moment, many of my learners are businesses who just want to learn how to make Social Media work for them.

I would be delighted Tim, to have a chat about how I can help you find a solution which works for you. I don't believe in a 'pushy' approach - I am following you on Twitter - so give me a shout if you would like to talk. :-)

Mary

Well, it just shows that Confucius was right - "1000 men, 1000 opinions". I've been watching Nigel B for more than a year. Having run my own businesses for nigh on forty years, participated in business self-help groups on occasion for thirty years (founding member, Solihull Small Business Club) and two years ago attended a business refresher seminar with Jonathan Jay, I figure I have a good idea about these issues. I can see when I'm in danger of being ripped off, and I have to say that I think that this (MySMB) is not one of those occasions. I have a business that needs marketing and yet after struggling with Website design and social media for years, I now have a professionally presented, structured program that for a mere £500 or so is filling in all the holes in my understanding of the subject. That alone is worth the money, and it will be of immense value when we start Franchising the sash window business next year. If you listen closely to the training program, NB always makes the point that you have to work at it, market yourself properly, and Walk the Walk before you go and try flogging your services to others.

This rant of yours should perhaps be directed at those who believe that it is possible to become a professional in weeks, rather than at NB. He does make the point that content MUST (if its to be any good) come from the client business. I've alway found that employing others to create content has always ended in tears which is why I've decided to learn to do it myself rather than entrust it to professional who havent got a clue about my business.

Well done for de-mystifying the whole process. As he says, "The first job is to sort out the mess" (on which I have just made a start, so watch this space).

Thanks for your comment Keith.

If we are quoting Confucius I would opt for: 'Faced with what is right, to leave it undone shows a lack of courage.' hence why this blog was written and considering the scant lack of evidence being offered that MySMB is delivering, combined with those who clearly are not flourishing, I fear my fears remain well founded.

Kudos to you Keith for realising that MySMB is ideal for understanding social media to help your own business. Those who have used it for their own businesses are thriving. We just do not think that MySMB can give you a strategic understanding - just like you know so much about business after 40 years! MySMB is topping up your business understanding.

Interesting you consider this a rant Keith, believe me I can write opinion editorial and this ain't one of them! As for suggesting it is misdirected, my time with the police taught me that you should always focus on the supply rather than the users. I accept Nigel Botterill emphasises the need to work at it on the course - but that was on the course, after people had spent their money after hearing how they could earn thousands of pounds by becoming a social media manager. The hype this time around in 2011 is greater, but to be fair so is the health warning.

So best of luck with your foray into social media and I've just followed you on Twitter - so see you on there!

All fair points, Nigel. I withdraw the 'rant' accusation. Not having seen it, I can't comment on the promotion that set this off. I binned the hardcopy mailshot that came through the door, retrieved it, studied it then looked hard at the website before deciding that it could be what I was looking for.

I have seen many 'get rich quick' come-ons over the years, and I took the prospect of signing a client up within weeks with more than a pinch of salt. However, having seen how many aspiring business coaches an inspirational speaker like Jonathan Jay can bring in, I have no reason to think that there won't be others out there for whom this will work very early on.

In my business (architectural joinery) there are just as many folk set themselves up as professionals before they're ready. (Crikey, that could be me, forty years ago!). We all have to start somewhere, and in the end, its up to the customer to decide who to support.

I suppose the first thing anyone in the SM business needs to do, is to make sure the links (to this post on my Twitter feed) are typed out properly :-(

HI there I have been looking at this "opportunity" from MySMB since seeing the ad in the Daily Express last week. To me I know a lot about this stuff but thought it might me useful. But after reading the posts here am thinking that it isn't for me.

Have just received an email from MySMB saying it is 24 hours before it closes. Though from this Blog this all happened last October too. So if I don't go ahead in the next 24 hours will the opportunity arise in a few months time?

Does anyone know if after it closes do you get emails saying the price has gone down as have found other videos in the sequence with different prices on. So for example Daily Express Offer takes you through to http://www.mysocialmediabusiness.co.uk/video1/ but http://www.mysocialmediabusiness.co.uk/video4/ has it for £197. From what I can see when you complete the purchase you then get the upsell re them designing the web site and getting your YouTube channel and Twitter accounts with their templates: http://www.mysocialmediabusiness.co.uk/BookingForm.aspx. So in all about £840 including VAT for the whole thing that then gives you an internet profile that looks like everyone else's and really isn't the whole thing about social media to be different?

Thanks for your comments Graham,

Indeed, MySMB was promoted last October and clearly was successful as a sales venture as it is being repeated. Interesting how many different links reach different prices! I imagine some of the MySMB customers will be grumpy when they've paid more than others for the same training.

You make an excellent point about all the MySMB websites looking the same. Some have bothered to change their websites, but most still look the same, have identical blog posts as other MySMB users and plenty have not been updated for months - yet they still claim to be experts. I asked those being flagged as successful My Social Media Business Managers to comment on a blog post asking them to 'Tell us your MySMB success stories' but none has commented. Some have ignored tweets asking them to comment, have ignored emails and consequently people are doubting their promotions saying they are earning thousands of pounds. Even Nigel Botterill himself has distanced himself from this blog, the busiest of those questioning MySMB. Begs the question why?

As for it being offered again? Surely it will - unless the backlash at identical sites and poor service from so-called social media managers stops it!

Like some others on here I have been mulling over the idea of buying a MySMB franchise. I was really excited about it initially as it is the one and only franchise to have appealed to me in a long time given my sales and marketing background, and the initial cost seemed reasonable.

As a relative 'newbie' to social media, I have done a lot of research around the subject - yes! Morgan PR consistently appears in my searches! - approaching it like a military campaign, and so becoming a bit more 'self-educated' in the process. It did strike me very early on, just as others have mentioned, that there were no case studies to show how this MySMB been successful. This surely is the proof that anyone needs to buy into - both from a franchisee and a client point of view? Surely one of a client's first questions is 'so, tell me exactly how this has worked for others?'. If there are no case studies of MySMB to show, even by proxy, how can I believe in this myself? Isn't the whole point of social media about sharing and communicating? Also the hype about closing dates - tomorrow by the way!! - is wayyyy too pushy; isn't that the antithesis of social media which is about engagement, not pressure?

I did take this seriously enough initially to offer for free my social media 'services' (once I was out of boot camp training!) to a couple of friends who run businesses so that I could iron out any teething problems and present a more professional image to any new clients - along with these actual case studies :-). I would still like be trained in social media, but I shall build my library of information in the mean time and look at other ways of becoming involved. I'd still like to have an initial training period in this so perhaps I shall look at Concise training online.

PS - 6 months since this blog started and STILL no-one from MySMB has come back with any case studies? That is definitely not doing them any favours.

PPS - no twitter or linkedin - not a luddite, just a SM manager in waiting!

Yet another person here who has read this blog over the last few days with increasing interest. I must admit that I am one of the people who initially looked at this as a get rich quick scheme, although I never thought it would reap the benefits they claimed. However, having just left my sales and marketing job, and in looking at future careers, the idea of earning enough to pay the rent while I looked for other things, doing something I know little about but have an existing interest in, did sound appealing. I am not convinced that it would have been money wasted either, as I do think the info offered would have been useful, current and well put together. Treated just as a training package, the initial outlay isn't so over the top as to be a complete rip off, although just a few days of research could probably turn up as much information elsewhere that is freely available. Having it all in one package is quite appealing.

However, their most recent email last night really ended it for me. It is the one that says that today is the last day, that if I don't sign up now I will miss out on this "slickest, sexiest, most fun, most lucrative, and most exciting business in 2011". This kind of hard sell is what made me research the hell out of this before putting my money down, and sending me this kind of email just screams desperation to me. It was a badly put together form email that had gaps in it, and was entitled "Improtant Announcement (sic)". Not important enough to spell check it and check it for errors, though.

Many thanks to PollyB and Paul for the latest comments on this blog - you have contributed to making this one the most heavily trafficked pages on my blog! Thank you!

PollyB, delighted that 'Morgan PR consistently appears' in your searches for all things social media. It is almost as if being established and well shared online contributes to how well the search enginges return your website to those looking! :oD! Just shout if you want a chat proper, have been know to chat as well as blog!

Interesting that both of you were considering MySMB, but it the actions, or lack of action, by MySMB itself and those using it that finally made up your minds? True advocates of social media from that stable would be monitoring this blog post and actively engaging with you both and trying to address concerns.

Finally, yes Paul, I too shake my head at the aggressive sales approach. I got that email, with its type from four people yesterday, all of which griped they had never signed up for it and how 'hard sell' it appears. You have to assume it works, which is sad and I wonder how thoughtful those who rush for their credit card can be if they see that as the right approach? After all, isn't social media about abundance?!

Although Social Media need not require expertise to build Facebook pages, twitter account, etc, it does require any understanding of marketing.

Interested most of the comments have been geared around the purchase of the product as a business investment but what about the investment of money that these so-called-social-media-businesses will be taking off people?

I personally believe I have sufficient experience and expertise in Social Media to advice others on what works and does not work but I certainly would not be doing that in another area especially if the training material is from 3 - 6 minute videos put together in a series of modules, I would certainly question the integrity of such a package.

I have also looked at some of the 'social media' work that has been conducted by users of mySMB and so what if they are earning £x,xxx a month, this is no measure of a clients success; just the perception of your own success measured in monetary worth.

Personally I think it is appalling that you take money of people if do not have a full grasp of what is required to make a campaign a true success.

In case anyone is wonder why my opinion should have any value.

I initially owned the twitter handle @gmail and handed over to Google, just to name one more that I have in my possession would be @opportunity.

I am almost in the process of completing a drag and drop UI to build facebook fan pages using wordpress.

www.1200bhp.co.uk Facebook fan page has over 1000 targeted fans.

www.iinclude.com [premium domain I own] has over 1000 targeted fans for a product that has not even been launched.

Thanks for your thoughts Azzam!

You make some valid points indeed and I checked out those Facebook fan pages - kudos, they look great! Will be refering a client to you shortly!

This has been a very interesting post to read overall. I take a completely un-biased view to both sides and would say this:

The world really did change circa 15 years ago when the internet got started commercially. I was very lucky to be in Silicon Valley at the time and worked at Macromedia between '97 to '99 as a Stock Options Analyst. I had no experience whatsoever about web development, production, web startup or whatever you want to call it. But here is what i can share with everyone novice or expert reading this post.

In America, there is an underlying ethos that "Yes We Can" ... it comes regardless of background or academic ability, it simply takes guts, determination and willingness to succeed. Many of our young and talented individuals are failing in the UK because there lacks a fundamental ethos to just get out there and do it! The yanks however don't care and break all the rules doing it, which is why they own twitter, linkedin, yahoo, google, facebook, kickstarter, Indiegogo, groupon and just about any global media that is now changing how we all work, live and play.

It is with the American spirit that I aim to develop LeicesterSquare.com as a UK Media startup, promoting UK lifestyle, culture and entertainment to the world in real time. It is very hard and challenging, but it's lots of fun. The old orders of everything is breaking down and allowing knew outlets to ensue.

MYSMB and Morgan PR are all part of the exciting new social media wave. We all win, as long as we are all determined to succeed. Some will get there quicker from years of experience and for some it will take more time. But as long as we all see the opportunities with social media and beyond, it's potentially win win for everyone!

Hey! if it doesn't work out, that's ok too! Just die trying lol!

Have you ever stopped to think our great country the UK owns the language of the internet? yet we hardly have any ubiquitous global enterprise presence on it?? All our eggs are still in one basket... "The City" & Finance. Big mistake! So for me, I am very excited at all the participants on both sides of this post, because it shows we are getting it, and like the slow tortoise, we can win the race! Big hug... Robert Haastrup-Timmi

Hi

I have spent the last hour reading this blog with great interest and a sinking feeling. I bought the mysmb package after receiving an email with a lnk to the sales video on the eve of going away for my first extended vacation for several years. I returned this week.

I do realise that I was less than careful in qualifying the opportunity before parting with my hard earned but, as a small company offering a web design service, have been looking for a way to help my clients get better results from the websites we sell them. I have almost no knowledge in the social media arena but what sold it to me was the fact that Mr Botterill had a long track record in helping people to start and run successful businesses, so expected that the training would be first class.

I've only had the chance so far to scan a few of the modules and I agree with the previous poster that this will take more than the 'weekends work' promised to master and certainly more than the few minutes a day to administer properly.

I'm also more than a little worried that, even though it has been more than two weeks since I bought the package, the only contact I have had so far from the mysmb team are some unprofessional looking emails which are still trying to sell me the business. Having been a salesman for over 20 years, I have to admit to not being impressed. In my experience, the only type of salesman who doesn't follow up on a sale is one who fears the response.

As I haven't completed the 'course' I cannot comment on the suitability of the content, but I didn't expect to be made an expert overnight. I simply wanted a simple and effective way to add value to what I already do for my customers without a massive time commitment from myself. Unfortunately, from what I've seen so far, simple, effective and time efficient are words that don't spring easily to mind.

You'd think over my 50 years I'd have learned not to part with money quite so easily.

I bought into MySMB with the intention of obtaining more information on social media promotion for my business. I have completed the course. It was easy to follow and understand. It has given me a better understanding of social media and how it works. As a result I will be applying it to my own business. I also paid for a MySMB website to be prepared and on receiving it I have decided not to proceed and only use the training modules for my own business and monitor the results accordingly. I thank Nigel Botterill for bringing Social media to my attention because as a result I am confident of being able to start using Social Media in the near future.

Well worth the £450 approx. + VAT paid for it. I suspect it has interested possible future Social Media people to start getting more involved in the media business. It is a pity that the influential people in Social Media do not go outside of their comfort zone and bring Social Media out to people like myself who typically want to get involved in Social Media as far as their business is concerned but lack the knowledge.

Peter

You've made my day. I thought I was the only one out there who had spotted MYSMB for who they really are. I cannot agree more with this post and I'll be looking you up on twitter/facebook/linkedin etc as soon as I post this comment.

NB and his team recently contacted me asking if I would be interested in MYSMB in Rossendale Lancs. I was initially interested, the websites are basic but don't need to be flashy, then I got thinking, hang-on..this is social media out of a box! So I declined. However, less than a week later, one of NB's phoned me back asking if I was interested in one of their BESTOF packages, erm... no thanks.

I then spotted a gentleman who lives less than a mile away from myself who had a MYSMB website. Hmmm, 12 likes on his facebook page (all other MYSMB owners), 112 twitter followers (following 800 himself) and 3 blog posts (last updated nearly 6 months ago). I tried contacting him through facebook, twitter and email..no reply. He has now bought a new franchise (not one of NB's) selling mod-kit for cars!!!!! Social media experts = my arse.

To be fair, out of the 100 or so MYSMB people I have found about 3 of them are doing it right. I have purposefully not included links to any individuals in this comment box, but I have tweeted the post and shared on my facebook page and profile in the hope that some of the 'experts' see this.

I've recently blocked a few of them following me on my twitter account, I even have screen shots where they have retweeted my comments but cut me out claiming it as their own.

Rant over, but good to see other people have noted NB and his social media 'experts' ;)

Thanks Dennis

Welcome to Club Concerned! This blog delivers a steady flow of comments and the more recent one asking for evidence of MySMB success... not so much!

We tend to find those doing it well often either already had experience in social media or sales or have stuck to promoting their own business which has nothing to do with social media, other than as promotional channels.

One or two of the 'big guns' are often already involved with The Best Of or have social media contracts closely linked with them, which doesn't evidence they are flourishing in the real world!

If people are lifting your tweets you should blog about it, or what I tend to do is RT them and thank them for the RT!

Keep up the good work!

Wow,

Am exploring many different ways to generate income and this article was quite enlightening.

There is so much hype and "fluff" that we are bombarded with and this was very informative.

The proof is in the pudding!