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[+] SAHMs in Manhattan - what is your HHI limit that let you stay home? My DH makes $25... 9 replies
Talk : : June 13, 2011
[+] Why don't more people adapt to a lower cost of living so one parent can stay at home?... 69 replies
- What's your hhi?...
- that they have altruistically chosen to SAH but now will need to get food from a food bank because of their lowered HHI, they will get unconditional support from you, right?...
Talk : : June 13, 2011
Why don't more people adapt to a lower cost of living so one parent can stay at home? I see so many people on UB say that they can't afford a SAHP. Well, what if you made the choice to live in a smaller, less nice place...eat homemade soups & stews...take your kids out of activities and just do free things in the city...buy secondhand furniture and clothes...AND decide that your kids are on their own for college (you can borrow for college but not for retirement!). How many people would choose a life with no iPad, no smart phone, no vacations if it meant someone was home with the kids every day?
69 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.13.11, 05:41 PM Flag ]no one is home with these kids? are they being left on the streets?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:44 PM FlagOur issue is that I want to stay in the metro area because my family and my dh family (we have big, close families) are both here. It is expensive here though! It's a sacrifice we are making. I wish we were raised in like Tennessee or Texas, somewhere where the living is cheap!
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:45 PM FlagI did that for years. We loved modestly so I could stay home. It worked for us, but who am I to judge someone else's choice?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:45 PM FlagI think when people say that they cannot afford to have one parent stay at home, what they really mean is that they don't feel comfortable with it. I would not be comfortable with one fair-sized income coming into the house, simply because I would feel too vulnerable.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:46 PM Flagwell I would not. I went without certain things as a kid, and I don't want my kids too. Also, I thought undergrads were pretty limited in what they could borrow for college (something like 7K a year) so can they really finance a degree for that amount? And as far as activities, my pediatrician actually recommends ALL kids get swim lessons, and for girls to seriously think about self defense, but I guess those are bad life skills to have, huh?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:46 PM FlagI would not - this is such a lame question. Why do you think it's better for a parent to be home? It may work well for some families - but not all. Why is it so hard for people to accept that everyone is different? People have different personalities and not everyone wants to stay home. That doesn't make them any less of a mother. If everyone was the same the world would be a horribly boring place.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:47 PM FlagThen say you don't want to for other reasons,don't say you can't afford it.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:49 PM FlagI could easily afford it. We don't live an extravagant lifestyle - but we live a comfortable one. We could easily live for many years on one or no income. But that doesn't mean we should. It's smart to have two incomes. The lifestyle OP suggests is risky - especially in this job market. If you have to cut back to bare bones to survive on one income, you probably don't have sufficient savings to live on for 2+ years if that person is out of work. It's a fine risk to take if staying home is important to you - but many people aren't comfortable w/ that risk and shouldn't be chastised for it.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:54 PM Flag
Because, sweetheart, some of us would never give up our rewarding, stimulating and gratifying work to stay home. Some of us believe that having working parents helps you to grow into a respectful partner, and enables you to understand your parents have interests and relationships outside of you. And some of us are already adapting to a lower cost of living because we are a double income family that cannot afford to have a parent stay at home.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:48 PM FlagI would never do this to my children. Both my parents worked, I had more than I ever needed, and a wonderful jumpstart in life.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:48 PM Flag-
OP, do you want to stay home permanently, or would you want to return to the workforce after DCs were a certain age?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:49 PM FlagThis is the decision that I made. I don't buy myself anything, count every penny and my child doesn't go to fancy classes. I have also been there for every big milestone, spent every day with her and we have an amazing bond because of it. For me it's been worth it but everyone has to decide what is right for them.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:52 PM FlagIt's not just about being able to afford it. It's about being a person with your own independence and career for your personal satisfaction and to be prepared for the inevitable hardship that life will throw you. What if DH loses his job, gets sick, you get divorced, blah blah. Keeping my career feels like the responsible thing to do for my family.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:53 PM FlagI wouldn't choose it, sorry. Our family has a great life and we spend plenty of time together. I couldn't care less about an iPad but I do care about having a nice home, providing a great education for my children (private now, and we will pay for college, as our parents did for us), plus vacations, etc. And besides, I like what I do and so does my DH. Stay at home if you want, but please don't think that people who don't are somehow inferior parents.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:54 PM FlagI can afford it, but I won't do it for several reasons: I enjoy working and feeling like a productive person, not to mention having adult conversations. I feel it's irresponsible to leave the family with just one income. I would not like the change in dynamic between DH and me if I were to do this, meaning that I would not want to feel obligated to do all the housework and childcare because I stayed home. We have mutual respect and are equals in every way right now; I could not see that lasting if one of us were to opt out of the workforce by choice. I would not be happy if I were financially dependent, and I would probably not be able to contain that misery around DCs. I like the extra money we put toward retirement, college, vacations, etc.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:09 PM FlagIDA at all with your implication that your kids are better off with a SAHM but saddled with future student loans than in daycare/with nanny and having college paid for, leaving them debt-free. Frankly I think SAH is often something women do for themselves, while telling themselves it's for their kids and that is one example.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:10 PM FlagI agree that most people really could make sacrifices and live on one income. My dh and I made that choice because we really do think it's best for our children for at least one parent to be home, raising them and instilling our values. Having said that, I DO NOT like being a SAHM. It doesn't fit my personality in the least. I'm simply not domestic and don't like being home. I do it because I firmly believe it's best for my kids.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:17 PM FlagI admire SAHMs because I think you are much more altruistic than me. I simply could not make that sacrifice. I also feel like my DD is cared for very well by her Nanny, and is most likely happier than she would be if I were home and miserable.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:19 PM FlagWhy would you be miserable at home? Even the stupidest things I do with DD are the highlight of my day. Today we built tunnels for matchbox cars out of paper towel tubes. It was the happiest moment. We go out and meet friends at Starbucks, she'll ride her bike on the playground while I speed walk, we are not chained to the house swiffering all day.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:24 PM FlagOR: to clarify, I would LOVE what you are describing. What would make me miserable is the feeling that not having a career is just too risky for me as a person, and for our family. I'm not a risk taker. It's just how I'm wired. I require plans and backup plans in order to feel safe and secure.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:27 PM FlagNP: I'm a SAHM and I wouldn't say I am miserable but most of the mundane things (like building tunnels, etc) I don't enjoy. I admit I hate doing crafts. My dd loves them, so I suffer through. I also don't like being home. When I had one kid we left the house at 9a and didn't return until 6p. Now that I have 2 and one on the way that just isn't feasible anymore.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:28 PM Flag
Homemade soup? Are you fucking kidding me? Do you have any idea how many people in this economy have been laid off through no fault of their own? Your comfy smug little SAHM life could end at any time. I went back to work for our financial security a month before my husband was laid off (had no idea it was going to happen). Thank god I didn't listen to self-righteous idiots like you, and instead I'm able to provide for my family. When DH gets a new job, I'll be keeping mine -- you can keep your homemade soup. I'll keep my health insurance.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:28 PM FlagNot OP - But if people live well UNDER their means, and have a SAHP, then you can also have a bigger safety net. I am sorry for your troubles. Homemade food is usually always less expensive than going out, but you know that this is not about soup for you. If you need help buying food, you can see if there is an Angel Food Ministry in your area.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:34 PM Flag
We live frugally, but still need 2 incomes. NY is an expensive place to live (we are in Brooklyn). Sure, we could move somewhere where the cost of living is cheaper, but then we would never be able to see our families the way we are able to now. We stay, and work.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:30 PM FlagWe're not living so high off the hog as it is. If either of us stopped working the other one would need to re-commit to career paths that includes lots of travel, lots of client entertainment. As it is, we both work in slightly less intense spots and can both find plenty of time to spend with dcs.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:37 PM FlagMy parents think the way you do. Both worked reduced schedules so both could spend time with my brother and me. While I love my parents to death, however, I would have rather been able to attend private school all the way through (I got myself there eventually with help from the grandparents). I can't really remember much from when I was a child, but a good education has value far beyond its own duration. Also, I don't understand this martyred attitude that raising a child has to involve so much sacrifice - I've had fun with it in part because we make enough to avoid the unpleasant parts like cleaning.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:55 PM FlagBut bright children can make the best out of any situation. I think it's fair for a family to say that because one parent SAH, public school is the only option. There are sacrifices. It's also fair to say that if one parent SAH, they can't afford a car, or vacation. There are a lot of opportunities to be had, and a lot of fun, even with a modest lifestyle. Also, you can teach your kids to clean if you don't like it! Even a 2 year old can wipe down baseboards. An 8 year old can handle laundry, etc. It's good for kids to pitch in.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:58 PM Flag
DH and I firm believers in the two-income trap (and I'm a SAHM), but your sanctimony isn't winning any converts. First of all, eating homemade soup ain't gonna cut it. Neither is coupon clipping. The reality is people have a lot expenses they can't escape such as student loans, mortgage payments and caring for elderly family members. Some families need that second job just to provide the health insurance if the other parent is an entrepreneur. People don't choose the WOHM for a freaking iPAD or an annual trip to Antigua!
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:00 PM FlagToo big burden of a burden to put on your working spouse, IMO, to insist on just getting by on one income if you would be much more financially secure on two. It's frankly quite selfish and e
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:01 PM Flag
[+] Anyone ever had success with making your cheap bf/husband generous? Or is that trait... 31 replies
- FWIW, our current HHI is 750k, but we met when we were in college, and both come from solid middle class families....
Talk : : June 13, 2011
Anyone ever had success with making your cheap bf/husband generous? Or is that trait just a dealbreaker? Just started dating a guy who's cheap. Constantly bitching about how much things cost, asked me to buy condoms, and the night i introduced him to my sister, we all went out for pizza. I had already eaten, so didn't get anything but my sister did. BF didn't pay for her. It was a slice and a soda! I was offended. I know he had a rough family life, so clearly he wasn't taught. But wondering if these things can be taught now or if it's too late. I tend to be overly generous- I'm always the one saying "dinner's on me!" and paying for everyone. I don't expect him to go to that extreme, but paying for my family is expected I think. What do you think? How do I handle this?
31 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.13.11, 01:40 PM Flag ]That sounds ridiculous. I think it's tough to change someone like that. My dh grew up without much money at all but is one of the most generous people I know. And he was generous even before he started making decent money. I'd move on if I were you. He won't buy condoms? That is REALLY lame.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 01:45 PM FlagLol, the guy won't pay for condoms? He must really think he's God's Gift! Please run, don't walk. He'll be even stingier as a husband.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 01:52 PM Flagdump him. and tell him why. condoms? that's mortifying. i'd just stop taking his calls. pretend he dropped off the face of the earth. if you must talk to him, tell him that no adult woman with any self respect whatsoever would keep a guy like him. you get that he's all effed up because he had a tough life. you're not without compassion. but you need someone who values you enough to do the right thing regardless of his baggage. if you can't imagine actually dumping him, tell him to get to working on himself. f you aren't serious with anyone else, you'll consider going out with him in 6 months. IF he goes to a shrink, can clearly articulate his issues and tell you how he would treat you if given a second chance. but seriously, this is too much work. best bet is to erase him.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:00 PM Flagyou need to stop with the overly generous. you're asking to be taken advantage of. tell as many people as possible IRL about the condoms and the slice of pizza. put yourself out on a limb so you HAVE to dump him. his motives, and what you believe to be a fundamentally good nature, are irrelevant. focus on the behavior. it's not acceptable.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:02 PM FlagRun. GF has the cheapest long-term boyfriend in history, and the dude is worth millions. It's one thing if you are both scrimping to save up for something, but if your overall outlook on life is cheap and suspicious, well...do you really want to spend a lot of time around someone like that?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:02 PM FlagMy boyfriend asked me after 4 or 5 months to buy condoms. I said if I got around to it. Never did (obviously). He asked me about it again and I told him I'd start buying condoms when he started footing the bill for half of my birth control pills. He immediately looked sheepish and it has not come up since. Repeat this conversation any time he tries to be stingy ("Do you have cash on you for dinner?" "I do, but I paid for dinner last night, so this one's on you."). I know this makes my BF sound awful but he is great in every other way- just needs to be reminded to not be a stingy dick when we are out. If he weren't great in every other way though, I would have dumped him.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:05 PM FlagMy husband is cheap, but not with me. There are different degrees of cheapness. Like, he'll only buy certain food if it's on sale (like crackers, or cookies, or yogurt), and he is really careful about turning off the AC and the heat unless it's absolutely necessary, and he'll always take public transport over a cab/car. But, he is not cheap with me or the kids -- when we were dating, he took me to really nice places (some of which were out of his budget at that time) and always paid, even when I insisted. He spends money on the kids (lessons, equipment, toys, books) and on us as a family (vacations, expensive appliances to make chores easier). So, you really have to think about where on the cheapness scale this guy fits.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:27 PM FlagNope, this is a deal breaker. Move on asap. He won't change. Sorry, OP.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 03:01 PM FlagThe condom thing would be a problem. However, I completely disagree with your statement that "payin gfor my family is expected". Why would your BF pay for your family?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 03:21 PM Flag-
I remember the first time I met a DF boyfriend at an ice cream parlor. He paid for DF's ice cream, and for mine. I thought it was a really nice gesture and thought DF was smart for finding such a nice guy. They're married now and he's careful with money in the grand scheme, but he never nickles and dimes anyone and it's always a pleasure to get together with them as a couple.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 03:34 PM FlagOk, the problem isn't that he's cheap, it's that he's selfish (actually he's both, but cheap you could probably live with and could actually be a good thing in terms of savings, selfish is why you should run away from him asap). In case I'm not being clear: cheap is choosing pizza over a 5 star restaurant, choosing rite -aid brand condoms over trojans. Selfish is making your girlfriend pay for said pizza and rite-aid condoms while you tuck your wallet back in your pocket.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:57 PM Flag
[+] Eating dinner together as a family and talking to each other every night is the best ... 153 replies
- husband is a mechanical engineer- works normal business hours at a large firm, on occasion he is very busy with a project and won't leave work until 6:30 or later (very rare), but his hours are also from about 8-5. We make a combined HHI of 200k, not in NYC. I find it sad that so many families have to resort to these 80 hour a week jobs in order to make a decent living. Not blaming it on them- but why would a company require someone to be at work until midnight...
Talk : : June 13, 2011
Eating dinner together as a family and talking to each other every night is the best gift you can give to your dcs.
153 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.13.11, 09:26 AM Flag ]i'm still trying to figure out at what age this is truly realistic. my kids go to bed at 7:30pm on school nights (ages 3, 8) and are eating dinner at 5:30-6pm, well before dh & i get home even on the best nights. we eat together on saturdays and sundays and some fridays but otherwise it's just not feasible. hoping as they get older and can go to bed later, it'll become more practical.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:32 AM FlagI did it every night as a kid with my mom,she worked,kept the house and had a hot meal on the table every night. Those dinners were important and now that she's gone I plan to carry it on as a testament to her.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:35 AM Flagor: my mom & i had dinner together every night even once she went back to work, but she had a 9-5pm job, so she was home by 6pm and I was 8yo at that point and went to bed a lot later than my kids do. my dad was never home for dinner until i was old enough to eat at 8:30pm - middle school maybe?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:44 AM Flag
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Agreed but it is not always feasible. I get home by 7:30 PM so I can eat with 3yo DD but DH rarely gets home before 10 PM during the week. Most families face that reality.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:37 AM Flagnot happening. I'm with my child all day. talk to her all day. Dh comes home throughout the day. We get enough talk time without meals every night. Live your own life.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:43 AM FlagDon't you worry you are raising animals? Meal times as a family is a pretty basic thing.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:01 AM Flag
I agree with this. When I was growing up meal time was sacred. We all helped set the table and clear the table and you had to have had skimmed the headlines of the NY Times or face a very quiet meal. Have been really fortunate that my DH gets home by 7:00pm and most nights we have dinner together. I usually give DS a late snack to tie him over till dinner time. I really look forward to it and I hope our DS, now 4, will appreciate it the family time together in the long run.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:48 AM FlagNiece at college told me that you can really tell the kids who ate dinner w/ their families from those who don't.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:53 AM Flag-
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I am sure she can't- all Ivy here. Care to name niece's school? She sounds like an idiot.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:05 AM Flag-
Still won't name the school eh? So maybe that is her community college observation.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:31 AM Flagnp: So when someone can tell if someone had family dinners each night (maybe based on wanting to go to the dining hall together as a group in the evenings- maybe not wanting to eat take out in front of the TV like some others- things like this I'm assuming), you have to ridicule them and say how stupid they are? I don't understand.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:30 PM Flag-
Going to an ivy generally just makes your opinions more white bread, and makes you feel awesome while you are really not different from anyone else.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:31 PM FlagUnfortunately, neither you nor your children will ever know if this is actually true.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:50 PM FlagBecause we will never encounter a self-important person who went to Princeton? Hon, I meet them all the time. Many of them can't even figure out how to send a professional-sounding email, much less be a good worker. The brand of your college doesn't mean much once you are about 5 years out.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 01:47 PM Flag
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really? the best gift in the entire world? more than self esteem? more than confidence? more than a loving home? stop with the drama, truly.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:51 AM FlagYes, actually, self-esteem, confidence and a loving home can all be derive from the quantity/quality time you give your kids. Much, much more than any words, gifts or pats on the back can.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:56 AM FlagAh, so you don't work and your husband has to struggle and give his kids less. Tell us more.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:59 AM Flag-
Yep, we'll see how your kids feel when they have college debt and no cars and all of this stuff and you pride yourself on doing nothing!
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:03 AM FlagWe actually have 2 cars and a college fund, so no worries. thank you.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:31 AM Flag-
np: what, we are supposed to have more than 2 cars per family these days? I thought NYC prided themselves on being green. At least thats what you all told me when I said I enjoyed the country because I had more space, etc. and I was flamed for driving around an SUV and wasting energy in my big old house, and that I was "ungreen". I think you all need to make up your minds about what you plan on insulting others for.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:33 PM Flag-
I have seen you post on a lot of SAHM threads, how the kids "will do without" b/c mom is a SAHM. This whole time I was thinking you were blue collar. Now it turns out you are just obsessed with material goods. She has to be ashamed of being middle class with 2 cars? Are you out of your gourd? Your kids are probably doing crack at their TT while you work 80 hours a week.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:34 PM Flag
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Since when does having a car equal a happy and well adjusted teenager?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:44 AM FlagSince when does having a lazy mom make you a better person?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:32 AM FlagI can't tell if your response means "lazy mom- aka mom who doesn't bother to have dinners for her family each night" or "lazy mom- aka mom who is SAH". Be more specific.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:32 PM FlagMom who lounges all day while the kids are in school, cooks some lousy dinner and harasses the members of the family who actually DO STUFF all day, to bask in this pretentious "family dinner" to assuage the fact that her boredom is only outweighed by her laziness.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:47 PM FlagI don't know what stuff you do that is so freaking important. Pushing papers? Answering phone? Solving the world energy crisis? Curing cancer? Everyone has their own priorities.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 01:28 PM FlagDon't be so upset if your family doesn't have family dinners, sheesh. Your kids aren't going to die, and you certainly don't need to post that people are pretentious and forcing family members to go through a useless old fashioned charade if a family decides they will make it a priority to all be home at 7 and eat together. It's not exactly abusive. To each her own.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 01:49 PM Flag"A number of studies show that children who eat dinner with their families regularly are less likely to get involved with drugs and alcohol than those who do not. They also tend to get better grades, exhibit less stress and eat better." http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/05/nyregion/05dinner.html
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 03:48 PM FlagAlso, since I know NYT is hardly a scientific journal, there is this one http://www.mendeley.com/research/relationship-between-frequency-family-dinner-adolescent-problem-behaviors-after-adjusting-other-family-characteristics/
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 03:49 PM Flag
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np: i don't disagree with you regarding the importance of family time. However, I don't know what you do or what your DH does, but you are both lucky to be home so early. There are a lot of professions where being home at 7 is just not possible. So what do you suggest? Should I tell my DH to drop the partnership he worked so hard for and go work for the government? Should I quit my own job? How about we do the best we can and make sure our DC has a loving family that can provide for his needs, even if that means only eating together 2 or 3 times a week?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:47 AM Flag
it's just food and I think people make too much about food. Hence we have food issues
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:57 AM FlagIt is not about the food but the commitment and support to each other
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:59 AM Flagmaybe it's important for kids who don't see their parents but honestly I refuse to think my kid will be missing out going to bed before I eat when I'm with her and talking with her hours throughout the day. I hated my family dinners when we ate home. Thank god we went out 4 days a week.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:07 AM FlagAre you a single parent? if so it is great for you that you get to speak to your daughter thru out the day - but once she is in school that will change. Why did you hate having dinner with your family?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:29 AM Flagno I'm not a single parent and unfortunately for us dh has not had much work. Great for dd though bc she sees her dad a lot. My parents made me sit at the table and eat things I hated till I was done. Hated it more than anything else and my mom was a bad cook. We ate out a lot so I could have vegetables and spaghetti most nights.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:34 AM Flagwell I guess there is a bright spot for being under employed - but regarding family dinners you could make it so much more enjoyable for your daughter - have her help make dinner get her involved and do not impose silly rules on your children - I bet you guys would have a good time
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:36 AM FlagI don't have rules. I just want her in bed so I can relax when I eat and we eat late. It is the one bright spot that I would like to see eradicated.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:41 AM Flagso basically you do not eat dinner together as a family because you do not want to - do you eat any meals together? I only bought up rules because you did - you make it sound like you do not do it because of your horrible childhood memories and I was only trying to show you it could be different for your daughter and she might look back on it and have good positive memories versus your bitter ones.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:47 AM Flagyes I eat lunch with her often, we go out to lunches on the weekends when it's nice and in the summer we have breakfast on the weekends. DH doesn't eat breakfast - whatever it's my family and don't not have meals because of bad memories - just because I eat later. I'm sure when she's older - she's almost 5 - we'll have more family meals. It's just not our thing. Her father btw spends way more time with her than other dads because of his situation. He comes home early and takes her to the park almost every day at 4-5 or so. We all do what's right for us. She is a very polite little girl according to other parents so I must be doing at least one thing right.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:10 AM Flaggod we are together as a family too often at this point especially in the winter. I just don't think the eating is the important part as long as the family spends time together as a family. I assume if you live in a suburb and either one or both parents commute, dinner would be your only real family time. It's different now for families especially living in the city.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:17 AM Flag
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Why do you hate the idea of having dinner as a family? I don't understand the animosity on this thread.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:34 PM FlagI hate the self-importance parents give themselves. Guess what? You are probably not that great of an influence- in amount or quality. Step down from the soapbox Sanctimommy.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:48 PM Flagnp: are you the mom who doesnt spend time with her 12 year old, or ever make her lunch? I personally see nothing wrong with parents having an influence over their children and spending time with them... you're saying spending no time with your children is fine? And honestly, you responded in a strangely hostile tone to a poster who simply said he/she didn't understand the animosity on this thread. Didn't exactly help him/her to understand it, I'm betting.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 01:44 PM Flag
She doesn't hate it. She just feels guilty she can't do it. How do you work at a decent job and get home in time for dinner? You can do what I do, which is get to work at 6 and leave at 3:30, but most people don't have that option.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:44 PM Flag
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Ugh, whatever. We do this every night and someone usually has a meltdown (sometimes me).
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:57 AM FlagITA. The responses saying "this isn't doable," "it's not 1955," whatever, fine. Whether it's possible fr you or not, it's still incredibly important.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:20 AM FlagTotally, because it not something you can start suddenly at 13 yo when you realize that your teen is growing away from you.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:30 AM FlagYes. There are things that aren't possible for my family (tuition at a private, nice vacations, classes for db), but I can acknowledge that they're ideal. Lots of the responses here are weirdly defensive.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:32 AM Flagnp: that is true, but otoh, if you're eating a family dinner on weekends when the kids are young and then maybe another 2 nights a week as they get older, i don't think that'll be the issue. the idea that it needs to be 7 nights/week from the time they're preschoolers is unrealistic. better to be realistic and consistent than throw in the towel bc you can't achieve perfection.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:34 AM Flag
We do this because we can but there are other things I do for dcs that feel a lot more important. This is goofy.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:31 AM FlagOP: I hear so many I can't or I don't want to. These words will boomerang.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:34 AM FlagI can't wait until your husband walks out and all your words boomerang, sanctilazy.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:33 AM FlagHer husband is going to walk out because she makes sure the family has a healthy dinner together each night? Huh? You know, not all old fashioned values are bad. Yes, some of them are highly outdated(moms should not work, etc.) but some of them- such as the importance of family dinners- are really rather benign and are still good ideas. You don't have to trash something just because it isn't new and trendy.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:35 PM Flag
I want DS asleep by 730pm. I want to work. So does DH. People picked a different path than you; get over it.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:21 PM FlagShe's just dumb and pretending that she contributes something of meaning to the world.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 12:52 PM FlagNP: No, she just has different priorities. And frankly choosing family or work or career is the right choice. It just is. What I don't get is why no one on here has said: We do Sunday dinners. We do Saturday night movie night. We do pizzas on friday. Whatever. The whole quality vs. quantity arguement. If you have some family tradition then it is worth arguing that you are doing something just as good as family dinners M-F.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:56 PM Flag
i cant always be home by 6pm when 3 yr old dd has dinner. DH is rarely home before 9pm but she has dinner with my mom and dad every night. For now I feel that is a good compromise...
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:34 AM FlagI am really surprised at how defensive many people got by reading this post. We always had dinner as a family growing up. We have dinner as a family now. That being said, I don't think your child will be maladjusted because you all didn't have dinner together. But, for us it's always a nice way to wind down the day, talk with everyone about our days, and transition into bath/story/bedtime afterwords.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:48 AM FlagAnd fwiw I do remember playing after school at friends houses and the friends without family dinners- such as making a sandwich and watching TV on our own, if we were 9 or 10- their houses always seemed kind of chaotic and strange to me. But that's because I was used to my family's calmer routine, I suppose. Not saying any other way is wrong, I just was not used to it,
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 10:49 AM Flag
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I prefer my kid knowing she can talk to me and my DH whenever she wants. We discuss her day constantly, whether we have dinner together or not (which we sometimes do, sometimes not). Flexibility and openness are more important than some strange set time for "talking." I grew up that way - could approach my parents at any time. Not just at dinner.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 11:37 AM FlagQuite honestly, I am very surprised that so many people here manage to have family dinner together every night. What do you/your spouses do? Because most professionals don't have the luxury of being home at 6 for family dinner.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:03 PM FlagI am a pediatric nurse practitioner in a small practice(office hours are 8-4, I'm out by 5 and home by 5:30). My husband is a mechanical engineer- works normal business hours at a large firm, on occasion he is very busy with a project and won't leave work until 6:30 or later (very rare), but his hours are also from about 8-5. We make a combined HHI of 200k, not in NYC. I find it sad that so many families have to resort to these 80 hour a week jobs in order to make a decent living. Not blaming it on them- but why would a company require someone to be at work until midnight for a project? Each firm/company tries to one-up the other by working harder and longer hours for clients and it's just gotten out of hand.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:55 PM FlagI'm a bookkeeper for a few private clients (consultants who would rather have me call their clients to get their bills paid, a liquor store owner who cannot remember to pay his vendors on time, etc.), so I set my own hours. DH is a CFO for a large non-profit, but his office is walking distance from our apartment and he often logs back in to do more work after DC has gone to bed. We have family dinner 5 nights a week, unless DH is traveling.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:18 PM Flag
Sometimes UB really makes me laugh. Dinner doesn't matter, lunch doesn't matter, breakfast doesn't matter (though, we do breakfast in our house.) What matters is spending quality, interactive time together as a family. It can be family game night, special outings, whatever. Usually I think the ladies on UB are smart, but think outside of the box! Do you really think it is the dinner together or the quality time? And if it is the quality time, you would have to be very thick indeed to think family dinner is the only form it can take.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:06 PM FlagI think that's crazy. I grew up in NYC with a (mostly) SAHM and we only ate dinner together when we went out. We ate at like 5:30 after sports practice or whatever and my parents ate later. As far as I can see I'm almost the only person I know who had a thoroughly happy childhood. We talked plenty. And now as a parent we do the same. The kids eat at 5 and we eat at 9. I talk to them plenty as well. We're a loving family and do what works for us. My best friend's had a sacrosanct family dinner and they are the most messed people I know. They said grace and it looked all perfect. To what end? I don't put pressure on my kids and love them to death. They need to watch me eat a sandwich? Sorry! I need to watch Mad Men and order Mexican instead.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:17 PM FlagI hate family dinner. DH is always upset with 4.5-yr old DD for fidgeting, playing with food, or being picky with food.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 02:55 PM FlagIs there something about sitting around a table with food? Or is it ok if you do lots of other things together as a family but not daily dinner? I think as long as you spend a lot of time together as a family it probably has the same effect. Maybe in some families they don't spend any other quality time together other than dinner.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:44 PM FlagMy husband's schedule doesn't permit him to be home for meals during the week. I have dinner with the kids every night and I honestly can't stand meal times with them. At what age does mealtime with your children become enjoyable?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:31 PM FlagWhy is it not enjoyable? Be a stickler for manners from the very beginning, seriously, even before 13 months you can model to your toddler how we talk to each other, eat nicely, talk about and enjoy our food. My DS is only 3.5 and he knows what table manners are expected of him, he is responsible for setting the table every night, and if he misbehaves, he gets a timeout and the most important thing is follow through, 100% of the time.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:20 PM FlagWhat's not enjoyable? Well, let's see the noise level, having to constantly say eat your food, sit down, drink your water, etc. Having the 16 month old through food and make a mess and/or having to feed him. At the end of my day I just want to relax. I hate to cook/prepare food so I'm already over it by the time we sit down and eat. We are not a set the table kind of family. If the table is actually clear and clean that's a plus for us. On the weekends when my dh's is there it's not any better. He doesn't like it either. We tell stories to the kids and talk to them and that helps but honestly it's just SO MUCH effort at the end of the day. I'm a SAHM so I have meals with them 3 times a day and talk/do activities with them all day so having dinner with them doesn't mean so much to me. BTW, surprisingly they don't do this in restaurants (well the baby does).
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:54 PM Flag
[+] (1) What's your HHI? (2) How would your life change if your HHI magically doubled? (3... 14 replies
- 'm just curious about the diminishing marginal returns of income. My HHI is about 65k, and it's likely to (at least)...'d have more wiggle room and save a lot more if HHI magically doubled. We'd only be marginally happier in terms of being less stressed. We would not change our lifestyle....
- Our HHI income has fluctuated a lot over the last 10 years -...
- HHI is around $100K. I don't think things would change much...
Talk : : June 13, 2011
(1) What's your HHI? (2) How would your life change if your HHI magically doubled? (3) How much happier would you be?
14 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.13.11, 07:38 AM Flag ]300k. Any increase would be saved - no change in the way we live. We'd retire earlier as soon as all savings goals were met.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:42 AM Flag(1)250 (2)We would be able to pay off mortgage or save enough to do so in the next 4 years. It would take a lot of stress out of our lives if we were able to do this. Not having to stress about making mortgage payments if we lost jobs etc would make us both a lot happier.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:47 AM FlagOP: FWIW, I'm just curious about the diminishing marginal returns of income. My HHI is about 65k, and it's likely to (at least) double in the next few months. (DH is getting out of the non-profit world into the world where he will actually make money.) I think I will be much happier!
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:51 AM FlagOur HHI income has fluctuated a lot over the last 10 years - from as high as 350K to as low to as 75K. We are at 250K. I would say our happiness was never tied to our income level - it's always been consistently very high. Higher than most people I know, I think.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 08:08 AM FlagWe'd spend some time catching up on our retirement savings (we were both in grad school for 6 years to get our PhDs) and then continue to save at a high rate. We would have nicer vacations and start saving for a new house. (We left NYC after we got our PhDs.) I would consider private school for my kids.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 08:10 AM FlagHHI is around $100K. I don't think things would change much if it magically doubled, and we're pretty happy right now. I guess we'd probably save more - we used to save a lot when our income was about double (before we had dd and we both took big pay cuts to spend more time with her), but I wouldn't trade time for money.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 08:14 AM Flag
[+] I am so upset with DH. We had another one of our constantly ongoing fights which see... 4 replies
Talk : : June 13, 2011
I am so upset with DH. We had another one of our constantly ongoing fights which seem to never end. He is a good father and really does try to be a good dh. He is very typical I guess in feeling that he is just my helper. We both WOH and I provide at least 50% HHI, he works late, sleeps later on the weekends, doesn’t cook etc. I said something mildly negative about it in a joking manner in front of our friends this weekend and he has been brewing& angry with me since. I have apologized and he seemed to soften up but was at it again this morning. I just blew up… Am I at the wrong here?
4 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.13.11, 07:28 AM Flag ]I don't think it's constructive to joke about something that is a source of your fights. If the roles were reversed, how would you feel? Apologize and tell him you were wrong to shame him in front of your friends. When he forgives you, in a week or so, bring up your true feelings about how you feel like he's not pulling his weight around the house.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:48 AM FlagYou need to sit down with him with a list of tasks that you do, tell him you are overwhelmed, and ask him to take ownership of some of the tasks on the list. If he agrees, you have to agree not to micromanage the way he does something. E.g., he will be responsible for dinner 3x/week (might be breakfast for dinner but whatever it is, he'll plan it & make it), DC's bedtime routine, etc. To me, it's frustrating when they say, "how can I help?" - I mean, I don't ask him that (if I see dirty dishes I just clean them, if there is toothpaste in the sink I just wipe it up). It may also come out that some things you do just aren't seen as important to him, and you have to think about whether it's something you want to choose to do, or you should let go
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 08:04 AM Flag
[+] 30 somethings, how much savings do you have? 30 replies
- 34yo - $2MM. HHI $360K. Been a single mom since I was 27....
Talk : : June 12, 2011
30 somethings, how much savings do you have?
30 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.12.11, 09:46 PM Flag ]$1.3M but we are about to pour 575K into a new apartment and then another 150K in renovations. Ugh. Freaks me out to say that! (half of that is from proceeds from sale of previous place which we paid extra on each month)
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 04:23 AM Flag-
Excellent! What do you do for a living . . . and will you mentor a 40-something single mom?
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 05:31 AM FlagI work in IT. Not sure if you are going to like it, but I moved into a jr. 2bd apt that cost $1800 a month for 6 years after my divorce. I cut our expenses to $2K a month and put away every single penny, which was about $180K. I began investing rather aggressively. In '08 I had about $900K. I took some risks and they paid off. In '10 I had $2MM and sold everything at the end of the year. Now, it's just cash in the bank. Trying to decide what to do next.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 09:22 AM Flag
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I'm 30, DH is 31. We have 80k in liquid savings, plus a total of about 100k in retirement funds (IRAs, 401Ks), and 125k invested as down payment on our co-op apartment.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 06:53 AM Flag$30k savings, $150k retirement. we're fortunate to both have jobs and i know we are not poor, but always feel poor when i see the responses to these types of questions on ub.
[ Reply | More ]06.13.11, 07:10 AM Flag-
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[+] I'd never heard HYP until going on UB. I'm a Harvard graduate and my husband graduate... 34 replies
- $250k loans. HHI 160k gross, 95k net. I have no hope in manhattan. Gotta hit the Midwest or south. Sadly :( I love NY...
Talk : : June 11, 2011
I'd never heard HYP until going on UB. I'm a Harvard graduate and my husband graduated from Northwestern. Our HHI is less than $110K when I work full time, and I'm now working part-time. We both work for non-profits. We are very happy, but we rent a 1-bdr and have 2 kids and will (hopefully) get our son into a public Pre-K second round. We're both 40 years old. Just want to let all you parents know that a "TT" college degree does not guarantee wealth later in life.
34 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.11.11, 07:49 PM Flag ]How's life in a 1 bedroom with two kids? We're about to have number two.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 07:51 PM FlagTough. Very tough. We took what was supposed to be the "den" (a large closet) and put both kids in there. We're in a floor-through (railroad layout) in a brownstone. No doors. We have to tiptoe around after they go to bed, and toys are everywhere (no real closets). We LOVE our neighborhood, though, and spend a lot of time outside at the local playgrounds.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 07:54 PM FlagI should add that the 3.5 yo (son) LOVES sharing with his 1 yo sister. And she's been sleeping much better since we moved her to his room and out of ours.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 07:55 PM FlagWe still have 2 yo in bedroom with us and were planning to put the new baby is a crib next to his brother's in our bedroom. Is it unrealistic to think we can have a newborn and a 2 yo sleep in the same room?
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 08:00 PM FlagNo. Our dd wasn't sleeping through the night until about a month ago (awakening and SCREAMING at 10 PM and at 4 AM for a bottle). We were shocked that even if she cried for 15-20 minutes, ds would sleep through the entire thing. And she now sleeps in until 6 (and wakes him early, as he never would wake before 7), but they laugh and giggle and throw toys out of the crib, etc. He's in a toddler bed right next to hers. They are wedged into a tiny room. Nothing else in there but a white noise machine.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 08:07 PM Flag
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yeah, in college i worked with a harvard graduate at a crunchy new-age bookstore, she took phone orders. i have to say, i was very unimpressed that harvard graduate would be working at a crunchy new-age bookstore talking about how hard calculus was (as if harvard even has a rigorous math requirement). not every graduate is a winner in the professional world.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 08:07 PM FlagAgreed. My husband and I went to a top-rated LAC and work in education. We barely break 100k. We're in a 2 bedroom in Brooklyn, but it's a stretch. I love the education I got, and sure, if making money had been my biggest motivator, I'd've made different life choices. But a fancy college doesn't mean automatic fancy paychecks.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 08:09 PM Flag
[+] Any recommendations for a non-stressful job/career path that is doable even though I"... 15 replies
- Best gig in the world. Rewarding, challenging, interesting, and also, very compatible with motherhood. You have to be able to take a severe cut in your HHI though....
- OP here - thanks, what do you teach? Not concerned about HHI, having 1 sane/available parent is more important to me. The masters in ed is a 2 year program or is there a fast track option?...
Talk : : June 11, 2011
Any recommendations for a non-stressful job/career path that is doable even though I"m trying to have kids now? I'm resigning from my job after much pressure, and haven't found any job posting yet that appeal to me. I have an MBA from a top school but am not looking to necessarily use it. The jobs I have had since graduating have been to high stress for what I can handle - I have also been doing IVF for the past year (failed) but at a new doctor and have hopes that it will work. I want to move into a career that will be sustainable with kids. Thanks
15 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.11.11, 01:46 PM Flag ]After I had kids I quit my high-stress corporate job and took a few years off. I got my teaching license, and when the kids got a bit older, got a job as a teacher. I love it. Best gig in the world. Rewarding, challenging, interesting, and also, very compatible with motherhood. You have to be able to take a severe cut in your HHI though.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 01:49 PM FlagOP here - thanks, what do you teach? Not concerned about HHI, having 1 sane/available parent is more important to me. The masters in ed is a 2 year program or is there a fast track option?
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 01:54 PM FlagOR: I teach math. You might be able to finish the MA in one year, or you might pursue the individual track to certification. You might have to take a few courses in education, but you will likely be able to use your undergrad and MBA credits to fulfill about 70% of the requirements.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 03:38 PM Flag
np: as a teacher don't you have to miss a lot of your own kids school stuff? Are you ever able to be there for their first day of school, their publishing parties, or chaperone their field trips? I imagine you can't do drop off or pick up so don't get to casually chat with the teacher or other parents.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 02:09 PM FlagOR: Yes, I do miss some stuff, but certainly not as much as I did when I was working a busy corporate job. Very lucky in that the school where I teach is very close to where we live (and where DCs go to school). They get home at 3:00 and I get home at 3:20. I can do drop-off on most mornings, but sometimes DH does it. I can use my personal days to attend certain school functions. But, I am not comparing teaching to being a SAHM. Obviously you get a lot more flexibility as a SAHM. I'm comparing it to high-stress 9-7 corporate jobs.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 03:40 PM Flag
[+] To which suburb should DH, DB, and I move? We know it's inevitable in a few years. We... 4 replies
Talk : : June 10, 2011
To which suburb should DH, DB, and I move? We know it's inevitable in a few years. We have family in Manhattan, LI, Westchester, NJ. We both WOH, HHI is about 250k, DH works on LI and I work in Manhattan. We love dining out, good wine, I love to shop, we like to work out, we're not very outdoorsy. We like nice things but we're not extravagant by any means. Where would be belong?
4 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.10.11, 08:56 AM Flag ]
[+] Hunter High School college admissions this year: 56 out of 187 students went to Ivies... 43 replies
- and how successful we are is obviously measured by our hhi...
Talk : : June 10, 2011
Hunter High School college admissions this year: 56 out of 187 students went to Ivies+MIT+Stanford. And their parents did not pay $35,000 a year.
43 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.10.11, 07:52 AM Flag ]Point is: very smart kids get into good colleges. Period. Good or bad, you cannot make your kid smart. So at least it's out of your hands.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 07:54 AM Flagright -- they didn't pay $35K a year AND they were fortunate that their dc got in.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 07:56 AM FlagYeah but MIT and Stanford are not Ivy league. I would be embarrassed to have one of my profoundly gifted children attend either.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 07:57 AM FlagTongue-in-cheek I know, but the Ivy League is an athletic conference. Stanford, MIT and CalTech are like Harvard, Yale, and Princeton. UChicago and Duke are ranked the same as Dartmouth, Penn, and Columbia. Hopkins and Northwestern are ranked like Cornell and Brown. Anyway congrats to any one who has the opportunity to attend any of the top colleges in the U.S., whether they go the Brearley/Chapin/Collegiate or Hunter or Anytown USA High.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:05 AM FlagHA! My dh went to Stanford and is a multi millionaire. I went to Princeton and make six figures. The college/ university one goes to does not determine how successful one will be.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:14 AM Flag
I don't think anyone will quibble as to whether or not Hunter is a top school. It is. Where did the remaining 131 end up?
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:06 AM Flag36 at liberal arts colleges, 22: in-state public colleges, 11: out-of-state public colleges, 25: top 30 universities, 25: top 60 unis (includes NYU, George Washington, BC and BU), 5 at art, music or engineering schools, 1 at McGill in Canada and 6 at what US News calls regional schools (4 at St John's in Queens, 1 at Emerson College in Boston and 1 at NYIT).
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 08:06 PM Flag
How compatitive are admissions to Hunter in middle school/high school? More or less competitive than an IVY?
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:15 AM FlagYou can't compare. The only admission to Hunter MS/HS is by a taking a 3 hour test in 6th grade or by staying on from the K. Admission is based solely on scoring high on that test, there are no report cards, teacher recommendations or interviews. Ivy/college admission is based on SATs, school reports, interviews, extracurriculars, etc.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 01:31 PM Flag
Yes, and that percentage is way lower than the TTs. Thanks for the heads up!
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:35 AM Flagthis sort of answer is so annoying. There are many kids at Hunter (and other specialized public schools I am sure) who only apply to SUNY and CUNY b/c their parents can't afford private college. Or who will only attend the private college that offers them the biggest scholarship (even if it is far less prestigious). At least that was the case years ago when I was there. I think more kids at Hunter could probably get into top colleges but not all even apply.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 07:07 PM Flag
I bet that is not that different of a % than the honors kids at any strong (non-gifted) public HS in the nyc metro area?
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:44 AM FlagHunter students have a very limited experience of New York City's diversity. The numbers of blacks and Latinos at the school is embarrassingly small.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 08:46 AM Flag-
There's a pretty wide range of family backgrounds by the high school level of most independent schools.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 10:12 AM FlagDC at a TT independent school and there is most certainly NOT a wide range. It's upper middle class to uber rich. There are very few middle class kids and even fewer - I'd say almost no - lower class or blue collar kids. Unless your frame of reference is upper middle to rich, there is little economic diversity. There is some ethnic diversity. But the idea that anyone has ever had to struggle for anything is totally foreign to the kids who attend TTs.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 02:29 PM Flag
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While I don't have the exact numbers, a large number of seniors this year are going to U of Chicago, Northwestern, and Amherst, Williams and Swarthmore, the three top liberal arts colleges in the U.S. All in all, it was a great year for this year's graduating class.
[ Reply | More ]06.11.11, 04:38 AM Flag
[+] Bankers out there: my HELOC is about to reach the end of the time when I can use it t... 3 replies
Talk : : June 09, 2011
Bankers out there: my HELOC is about to reach the end of the time when I can use it to pay for anything, but i'll have 20 years to pay off the principal. Right now, I have $170K credit available, prime +0. Meanwhile, I regretfully refinanced 1-2 yrs ago and didn't use the HELOC to lower our principal. On our current mortgage, we pay $3.3K/mo, 5%, 28 yrs left. Is there any scenario where it would be wise to use the incredibly cheap HELOC to reduce our mortgage principal, given the fact that HHI is 265K and DH is in unstable job?
3 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.09.11, 07:50 PM Flag ]Prime floats that means if interest rates go up, you'll pay more. Fixed is better if you're not moving for a while and 5% is a good rate, not the best but historically low. Do you have other debt to pay off (credit card, auto, student loans?), that might make sense because you'll probably lower your payments.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 07:53 PM FlagI wouldn't advise anyone to use a HELOC to pay off credit cards or car loans when the borrower is in an unstable job. Is it really worth it to risk losing your house if your finances go south? While in the short run, you'll lower your interest rate, you may run your cc balances back up again. Let's assume worst case scenario: if you can't pay your cc bills, you can default. If you can't pay your car loan, they'll repossess your car. If you can't pay your HELOC, they'll take your house.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 08:03 PM Flag
[+] Bankers out there: my HELOC is about to reach the end of the time when I can use it t...
Talk : : June 09, 2011
Bankers out there: my HELOC is about to reach the end of the time when I can use it to pay for anything, but i'll have 20 years to pay off the principal. Right now, I have $170K credit available, prime +0. Meanwhile, I regretfully refinanced 1-2 yrs ago and didn't use the HELOC to lower our principal. On our current mortgage, we pay $3.3K/mo, 5%, 28 yrs left. Is there any scenario where it would be wise to use the incredibly cheap HELOC to reduce our mortgage principal, given the fact that HHI is 265K and DH is in unstable job?
[ Reply | Watch | More06.09.11, 07:49 PM Flag ]
[+] I'm wondering, where did the perception that SAHMs' husbands cheat more than WOHMs co... 13 replies
Talk : : June 09, 2011
I'm wondering, where did the perception that SAHMs' husbands cheat more than WOHMs come from? I have never heard of this generalization before UB. I'm a WOHM who earned 50% of our HHI and my exDH cheated on me with a coworker.
13 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.09.11, 02:23 PM Flag ]I think WOHMs are exposed to a lot of douchebag men at work who act like they don't respect their SAHWs, so they get this perception that they are cheating. Little do they know that their own husbands are likely sending the same signals to their female colleagues.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 02:27 PM FlagA cheater will cheat on Angelina Jolie just as soon as he'd cheat on a ham sandwich. It doesn't matter what the woman does, or how she looks.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 02:53 PM FlagI have read that opportunity is one factor (not the only one, so it doesn't mean that jerks won't find a way or that someone committed will cheat just due to opportunity). It's apparently ONE factor. Perhaps this is misconstrued and becomes the idea that men have more opportunity if their wives are home which is not really true. The opportunity factor (again, just one of many factors, not dispositive) is more about where the man is.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 03:02 PM Flag
[+] Private school question: tuition is 12k, hhi is $150k, should we apply for aid? No... 10 replies
Talk : : June 09, 2011
Private school question: tuition is 12k, hhi is $150k, should we apply for aid? Not in NYC, fwiw.
10 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.09.11, 11:21 AM Flag ]12k is a significant portion of our income. We werent planing on private for our dc, but it seems like she would be better off in a particular private, rather than our public. She would be an "asset" to them as well. Not looking for 100 percent, but something would be helpful.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 11:28 AM Flag-
We've got our student loans, which come to about $1k a month. In this economy we can't pay out of our emergency fund- which is our savings . . .
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 11:47 AM FlagI can't believe people are this dense out there. Apply for aid if you want - in the unlikely event that you get it, you're taking money away from kids who really need it - but that's up to the school to decide. If you can't afford school because you choose to spend your money on other things - that doesn't make you a person who needs aid. If I make $1 million a year and have mortgages on my houses and yacht that run me 90% of my pre-tax income, should my kids get a free ride to school?
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 12:03 PM Flag
im sorry! you should not have even asked that question! I am a family of 4. my 2 girls are 1 and 3 1/2 and i only make under $30k a year. and im hoping i will be qualified! im sorry but that upsets me.
[ Reply | More ]06.10.11, 06:15 PM Flag
[+] Hijack from all the brand name shopping posts. Our HHI is about 300k, we own our own... 4 replies
Talk : : June 09, 2011
Hijack from all the brand name shopping posts. Our HHI is about 300k, we own our own home, and live very comfortably. However, I don't spend a lot of money on clothes for myself (or for my kids, who are both boys, ages 6 and 3). For the kids, I shop at the Children's Place, Old Navy, Gap. For myself, I shop at Century 21, Marshalls, NY&Co, and sometimes at the Gap and Old Navy. I think we all look fantastic, mostly because we are all good looking, fit, and healthy, and because our clothes are simple and comfortable. I think it is women who judge other women for labels and brand names. Men really couldn't care less, as long as you are attractive. My husband doesn't care whether my dress cost 30 dollars or 300 dollars, because all he wants to do is take it off me. Well, just my two cents.
4 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.09.11, 08:52 AM Flag ]ITA. My DH could not care less if it's a DVF top, AG jeans, or whatever. He hates trendy stuff, actually (used to joke that I wore librarian skirs when I'd wear those knee-length, high-waisted pencil skirts). Some of the people I know who spend the most on clothes and accessorries look very tacky. I think it all comes down to how well you pull yourself together.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 09:04 AM FlagOP: I am not against spending money to look good, but I don't think expensive clothes are necessary to look good. If you have a nice body, clear and smooth skin, a nice hair cut, you will look just as good in a 30 dollar dress as you would in a 300 dollar dress.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 09:19 AM Flag
ITA. We make $350k, pay for basic cable, got smartphones only this year, and shop at the places you shop and will only buy things on sale, DS is in hand-me-downs, etc. But we are happy and we're certainly not claiming to be MC on our HHI.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 09:30 AM FlagOP: Exactly. My 3yo is wearing a lot of his brother's old clothes, and it's all great. I mean, can you really tell the difference between a 3 dollar pair of cotton shorts from Children's Place and an expensive one from some designer? I can't. My kids can't. And they outgrow the clothes so quickly. Just don't understand the brand label obsession, especially when it comes to clothes for little kids.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 09:33 AM Flag
[+] What is your mortgage and HHI. How about maintenance and property taxes? 13 replies
- 2800 mtg 1700 mtnce 2nd mtg 1700, 250 HHI...
- HHI 730K, mortgage 1.725M, maint/prop tax $3400/mo...
- $1200 mortgage, no maintenance, HHI $340K...
- every month for the inevitable home repairs). HHI is 200k....
- HHI 300k; mortgages $1,200/mo. and $1,500/...
Talk : : June 09, 2011
[+] What is your mortgage and HHI. How about maintenance and property taxes? 8 replies
- $285k, HHI $250k. Taxes about $9k....
- $360k (incl. HELOC); HHI $120k; taxes $8k...
- I think that is good. About 1-1 1/2x HHI income....
- £270k, HHI £160k, taxes £2k, no maintenance (House)...
Talk : : June 09, 2011
[+] Why do I fill my life with worry? I worry about my perfectly normal and smart 6yo dd... 9 replies
Talk : : June 09, 2011
Why do I fill my life with worry? I worry about my perfectly normal and smart 6yo dd for getting a 56% on the G&T, worry about deciding not to send her/apply to a private school becase we cant comfortably afford to send our 2 dcs (ds is 3yo), worry about deciding to live in a small 2bedroom apt. in NYC with my two kids, etc.etc.etc... I was perfectly normal (and worry-free!) when my dh was going throughr residency and fellowship and we were living on a HHI of 70K in NYC, but I worry now! what's wrong with me?
9 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.09.11, 07:35 AM Flag ]I am you...though at least you dh is a doc! Some advice. Find a good public. We started sending our ds to private though it was really beyond our means and it has been excruciating to extract ourselves. Also, remind yourself that you would find something to worry about even if those issues were resolved and, on occasion, remind yourself of all the horrible problems that really create worry that you do not have. For example, we are in a tiny place, still waiting to hear from schools, my dc got a 27% on g&t, and dh has no job. But everyone is healthy thankfully.
[ Reply | More ]06.09.11, 08:06 AM Flag
[+] Spin-off, does your DH earn more than you? Are you bothered by this? Do you comingle ... 6 replies
- He makes >2x and we do both: contribute a portion of our salary equal to our portion of HHI (there's a word for it) into joint and keep the rest in separate individual accounts to do with what we want....
Talk : : June 08, 2011
[+] Best place in the city to live with a family of 4? HHI is $600K. Manhattan only, sorr... 62 replies
- This has to be fake. Just someone trying to brag about her high hhi AGAIN....
Talk : : June 08, 2011
Best place in the city to live with a family of 4? HHI is $600K. Manhattan only, sorry.
62 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.08.11, 08:51 AM Flag ]You can't afford Manhattan on that income. You should try Queens (Astoria) or East Harlem (though I guess that's technically Manhattan still).
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 08:53 AM Flag-
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OR from above. I was joking as well, but thanks for the unnecessary name calling. How old are you, 6? or are you the 6 year old princess' mommy from below?
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 08:56 AM Flag
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If you're going private you could live in a nice place in Harlem: http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/746029-condo-159-west-118th-street-central-harlem-new-york
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:09 AM FlagYes, I could do Harlem. We've been thinking of buying a townhouse in Harlem and renovating it, but others have told me a townhouse is asking for too many financial responsibilities.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:11 AM FlagYou can rent a sizeable apartment. Are the kids in HS? How much space do they want/need?
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:13 AM FlagNo, the kids are ages 6mo, 18mo, 3yo & 4yo. I would like at least 1500sq/ft.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:33 AM Flag-
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/767697-townhouse-136-west-130th-street-central-harlem-new-york * http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/746029-condo-159-west-118th-street-central-harlem-new-york * http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/770233-rental-1428-lexington-ave-carnegie-hill-new-york * http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/768951-rental-309-east-81st-street-yorkville-new-york
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 10:45 AM Flag
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Oooh. I live down the street. That building is on a nice block and there are so many amenities inthe neighborhood now, especially on 8th ave/FDB (organic markets, great non-soul food restaurants, bars, boutiques). We are a family of 4 (2 kids) and live in a Harlem condo which we love, but if we had 4 kids and were committed to staying in Manhattan, I would go for a brownstone, or stay in a smallish apt and buy a Hamptons/country place for weekends.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:30 AM Flag
Look around Yorkville. With the Transfer Station thing you may be able to pick up a big place cheap and the public schools are good around there.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:11 AM FlagIf you have 4 kids, what is it about Manhattan that limits your option only to that borough? If that's your preference fine but if you're worried about commute there are places that lets you get a big house with a 30 min commute
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:22 AM Flag-
I don't want to live in the 'burbs. Just a preference. I don't need a big house.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:30 AM FlagI hear you. If you have the money, find a renovated Harlem brownstone. Otherwise, those requiring gut renos that are in southern Harlem (which is where you want to be for services and amenities) are still so pricey to then have to spend nearly $1m on the reno.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:32 AM Flag
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Where would you be commuting to? Cobble Hill in Brooklyn might be very appealing after London, you could look for a duplex/triplex or whole townhouse rental in PS 29. F train can be a drag but it's an easy transfer to the A, and a short enough walk to Borough Hall. (I'm in Brooklyn Heights and commute to midtown, it would take me just as long if I lived at say 110 and Riverside. I also meet tons of British moms who live in Cobble Hill, there must be something that reminds them of home.)
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:27 AM FlagYou really should consider some parts of Brooklyn, like Dumbo, Brooklyn Heights, and Cobble Hill you will be in the city in 15min.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 09:43 AM FlagI like the UES b/c while it is more suburban with worse restaurants than downtown, Central Park is great for the kids and there are a ton of kids activities. There are strong public schools but private schools if you need them for one child. I would move to PS6 or near Carl Schurz Park.
[ Reply | More ]06.08.11, 12:32 PM Flag
[+] Sitting here waiting for a WOHM vs. SAHM debate, or the mom with a hhi of 750k but do... 1 reply
Talk : : June 08, 2011
[+] All this talk about being able to "afford" a nanny...so I'm curious as to how much a ... 22 replies
Talk : : June 07, 2011
All this talk about being able to "afford" a nanny...so I'm curious as to how much a family must gross and how much they must pay said nanny to afford her. If DH and DW earn a HHI of 250k, does that mean they can't afford a nanny or how much should they pay? TIA
22 replies [ Reply | Watch | MoreYou can get a nanny for $300/wk. The less you pay, the harder they work.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:38 PM Flaglove that one. unfortunately some ppl here wish it were true.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:39 PM FlagIt is...I have a college educated teacher that we pay $1200/week. She's very engaging, but can be lazy, and does no additional cleaning, even the basics like unloading the dishwasher. My neighbors pay a woman from Trinidad $300/wk and she shows up to work 30 minutes early every day to unload the dishwasher and prepare for the day, does a ton of cooking, etc. She works way harder than my nanny...but DH and I wanted a native English speaker w/ no accent (no Brits or Aussies either)
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:42 PM Flag-
That woman isn't working hard because she's being paid less- she is working hard because she is an excellent worker, and as soon as she gets wind that she can make twice that somewhere else, she will probably be out of there. Either that or she is working so hard hoping for a desperately needed raise, which that family is too cruel to give her, which makes me feel just awful.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 08:16 PM FlagShe is so devoted, it is ridiculous. She asked for a raise. They said no. They just doubled the size of their apartment with an addition. If she works for me, I give her $15/hr. She knows she can get more money elsewhere, because she stays because that is her work ethic and devotion to the child. I wish I found it admirable, but really I wish she'd go get a job with someone reasonable.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 08:18 PM Flag
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You can spend anywhere from 30k to 90k a year on a nanny depending on how long you've had the person; the hours; the responsibilities; their experience; whether you pay on or off the books. Nobody can tell you how much you have to gross to 'afford' a nanny - it's all about your priorities and expenses. Daycare in NYC is quite pricey - especially for 2 DC - and you need backup care for sick days and conflicting holidays.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:45 PM Flag-
Good for you - most don't and shouldn't - it's not a six-figure role. Some nannies work tons of hours and do much more than care for the children - more household management and maintenance. That's not your typical nanny position.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:54 PM FlagI was childcare only, but the mom was atrocious. Only family I ever walked out on with no notice.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:57 PM Flagagree most of my friends are working mothers NOBODY is paying anywhere near that. Only way to get that kind of $$$ is to work for a celebrity. Most of my friends are in the $450-$700 wk (various locations, various hours, diff # of kids)
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:57 PM Flag
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also depends on where you live. NYC, if so, Manhattan or boroughs? suburbs? live in or live out? what other benefits? how much vacation time?
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 07:50 PM Flag
[+] Are we middle class? DH & I live in Brooklyn. I am a music teacher at a private sch... 25 replies
- every penny. This is my second career, and my first career was a lot more lucrative. For about 4 years we had a HHI of 300k. As a result, we were able to put 350k down when we bought the house. We also got a good deal on...
- ^^ oops, made a typo -- our downpayment was 300k, and our pre-kids HHI was 350k, not that it makes much of a difference. But those are the details....
Talk : : June 07, 2011
Are we middle class? DH & I live in Brooklyn. I am a music teacher at a private school and make 25k a year. DH is an engineer and makes 150k. We own our own home (2800 sq ft), which has a rental (additional 1100 sq ft). Our mortgage is 2k a month, and our rental income is 1200/month. We have a 10 year old Toyota. We vacation abroad once a year, and take about 3 driving vacations per year. Both kids are in public school. We have 120k in savings, and save about 25k/year. I feel like we live a very luxurious lifestyle. What do you all think?
25 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.07.11, 02:46 PM Flag ]You are doing very well! Please tell me how you purchased such a large house, and where it is. We have been looking (in Bk) for a while and they are so far out of our range.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 02:50 PM Flagop - Bought our home 6 years ago, and put 300k down. We got married young, lived very cheaply, and saved every penny. This is my second career, and my first career was a lot more lucrative. For about 4 years we had a HHI of 300k. As a result, we were able to put 350k down when we bought the house. We also got a good deal on it because it needed renovations. DH's uncle is a contractor, and cut our renovation costs by half (at least). Our home is in Bay Ridge (south part), which is remote for a lot of people who commute to Manhattan.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 02:54 PM FlagNP we looked at Bay Ridge too, and LOVED it, but the commute would be impossible. How long does it take you to get to work?
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 02:56 PM FlagI lived there for 5 years, and I know it well! We were looking there too, but the houses are in the 700-800k ranges and they are in horrible shape. Just wondering what kind of Engineer DH is, and what your first (and current) career was. I ask because we are both IT "Engineers".
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 02:57 PM Flagop - DH is an IT engineer at an investment bank. I was a financial analyst. This was during the boom years. Our home cost a little over 700k, and we took out a 400k mortgage at 4% (for 30 years).
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:00 PM FlagI spent my entire career doing IT for investment banks! I'll bet I know him!
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:02 PM Flag^^You have reinspired me to look into Bay Ridge. Thank you. :)
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:04 PM Flagop - If you don't need to commute too far uptown, and can afford the express bus, it's definitely doable. I love the neighborhood, the schools, everything, but the distance from Manhattan is a big consideration. That's one reason why it's still affordable compared to other areas in Brooklyn.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:08 PM Flag
op - I also want to point out that I consider switching careers from something lucrative that I absolutely hated to something low-paying that I absolutely love a huge luxury. Especially since we have kids. I get to spend a lot of time at home/with the kids/by myself. All this free time is a huge luxury, in my opinion.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:03 PM Flag
Don't you mind all the horribly racist Italian people in Bay Ridge?
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:11 PM Flagop - It's not so awful. It's a pretty diverse area. Lots of immigrants from the Middle East, China, Russia. But, yes, I can't lie. There are a lot of racist Italian people who vote Republican. That's a fact, but we've been able to find plenty of like-minded liberal people to associate with.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:14 PM Flag^^^ and the racist Italian people aren't openly racist. Yes, I know that they vote Republican (we are the only district in NYC to have a republic congressman, after all) but it's not like we argue about politics while we hang out on the stoops. They are generally friendly and down-to-earth people, and their politics don't bother me too much.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:16 PM Flag
It sounds like you're very satisfied with your life. That puts you ahead of about 99% of the population in terms of mental health. Yea for you!!
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 02:57 PM Flagop - That was sort of my point, in response to all the UMC/MC posts. On paper, our lifestyle doesn't look like much. But I think it's pretty darn luxurious. Maybe it's a matter of perspective. But I didn't have such a sweet life as my kids do when I was growing up.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 03:06 PM Flag
[+] Are we middle class? DH & I live in Boston, not NYC. I am a substitute teacher and ... 32 replies
- I live in the Boston area, our HHI is $60K, we own a home (~$1400/month), own a used car, and only drive to see family and go to weddings (this is our vacation). 1 kid, DH stays home during the day, works evenings. And I consider us solidly middle class....
Talk : : June 07, 2011
Are we middle class? DH & I live in Boston, not NYC. I am a substitute teacher and make less than $9,000/year. DH is a senior copywriter and makes $90,000/year. We do not own a home, we rent and pay $2100/mo. We have two kids both in public school. We have about $200,000 in savings. We don't own a car, we only take driving vacations. We don't have much left over every week, but we get by.
32 replies [ Reply | Watch | More06.07.11, 10:54 AM Flag ]-
Probably LMC because we can't afford the "nice" things that everyone else seems to have: car, flat screen tv, XM radio, "real" vacations, gym membership. We live really frugally and are committed to our savings. DH says that you never know the debt that people with "nice" things have. We have $0 credit card or any other debt.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 10:57 AM Flag
I lived in Boston in the mid-1990s. I was single and earning $160K at the time. I considered myself on the upper end of middle class, but definitely not UMC. Boston is an expensive place to live.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:00 AM FlagYou should be able to live pretty well on that in ANY city in the US. I have lived in both NYC and SF (both costlier than Boston) and could easily survive on that. Frankly my husband and I combined lived on less and went on vacation and lived in a ncie neighborhood and went out to dinner...
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:10 AM Flag
I'm glad to see this argument applies to places other than NYC!
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:03 AM Flagno, it doesn't. She lives in the South End. There are many other nice parts of Boston to live in that could save them money so they could buy some of the things they want.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:05 AM FlagOP - definitely. But our #1 priority was living within blocks of DH's office. He works long & unpredictable hours and he wants every precious moment with the kids that he can have. So our sacrifice is tiny living space and higher rent in return for no commute, he can even come home for lunch. In that sense, we are indeed very lucky.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:14 AM Flag
OP - I guess the hardest thing for me is not letting possessions and THINGS define how MC I "feel." This is my own bag, and I get it. I AM grateful for everything we have, and I know that everything is a choice. But like, I never got the "nice" stroller like an Uppa Baby, I got a used Maclaren from Craigslist. My kids wear thrift store clothes and their "nicest" clothes are from Old Navy. We have a behemoth old tv and no cable. Our "nice" furniture is from Ikea and the rest hand-me-downs/Craigslist. So in that way, I feel like we are not MC. I also feel like renting is an "insecure" situation to be in, and that makes me think we are far from MC as well. Just food for thought, I guess.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:04 AM FlagYou have a ton of savings, though. How did you save that much of your income?
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:05 AM FlagWell, basically, thriftstore clothes, beans and rice, and nothing "nice" at all. DH and I lived like paupers when we were first married, too. DH also received a small inheritance (about $12k) from a grandparent. But choosing to save and not spend is always on our minds. I get most of the kids books at thriftstores and ALL their playclothes from Goodwill. I just get down sometimes when it seems like we don't have smart phones or iPads or "real" furniture that most couples and families have. I mean, my cousin just graduated and got her first job, this is in Maryland, but she bought her first condo for $160k and outfitted in "real" sets of matching furniture. I feel like we are so far from being able to do that! So there's some jealousy here, for sure.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:13 AM FlagThat's not a "ton" of savings at 37 and 38. That is a healthy amount of savings.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:20 AM Flag
YOU ARE DESCRIBING HOW THE MIDDLE CLASS IN THIS COUNTRY LIVES. YOU ARE MIDDLE CLASS. Though having no debt makes you in a very good position.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:06 AM Flag-
np: you are consumed by the idea that being middle class is defined by your stuff. but it's actually defined as having financial stability. you can afford your necessities. you could choose to live in a more affordable area and have more left over for savings too. you could think about going back to work FT when the kids go to school and that would give you more income for saving/spending as well. but quite frankly, a stroller that runs upwards of $600 is ridiculous - as my mom always says, why does a MC person need to own "the most expensive" of something, that's what the rich should own. we are definitely UMC with all the trappings and I thought the $275 Maclaren was a luxury. It's been through 4 kids (2 mine, 2 my sisters) and about to be retired and still in decent shape.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:17 AM FlagPersonally, I think you are living (a bit) below your means. But if I were you, I wouldn't buy a house or furniture, I'd set a budget for experiential treats -- a concert, an extra weekend hiking, a pottery class, or even two lattes per week. Given your family's income and financial security, you shouldn't feel deprived. Think of some small splurges that might help with this.
[ Reply | More ]06.07.11, 11:22 AM Flag
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